Posted on Tuesday, Nov 20, 2007 - 10:18 am:

This newsletter offers a way to keep up with the horse information added to Horseadvice.com without overwhelming your email box. Posted every day or two this newsletter will highlight the new topics and discussions added to the main sections of Horseadvice.com. Note that replies to discussions, and some member's only posting areas are not displayed here. For a complete listing of topics and discussions please visit us at Horseadvice.com.

Bringing the boys home...
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HorseAdvice.com: Member's Services members_only: The Lounge: Kick back and relax.: General Interest Stories and Discussions: Bringing the boys home...
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Posted by Gwen Robison on Sunday, Nov 18, 2007 - 8:55 pm:
Well, after a year of boarding bliss, I am bringing my pony and my tb
home to my backyard. My quarter horse is staying at the boarding barn
because his lease is working (the woman adores him) for now. The pony
on the other hand, tossed his little girl one too many times. He is
off to resume his duties as pasture puff. I have mixed emotions,
because I really do love seeing them in my yard everyday. I will
really miss the place I was boarding, though. I love the people and
care, and loved that I could spend all of my "horse time" just being
with my horse. Now I am off to get electric tape that will hopefully
keep little houdini confined.

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Feed dealer wants us to consider changing feed brands...
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Equine Nutrition, Horse Feeds, Feeding: Equine Nutrition an Overview of Feeding Horses: Feed dealer wants us to consider changing feed brands...
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Posted by Judy Henslee on Saturday, Nov 17, 2007 - 12:44 pm:
We have a feed dealer we have used for the past three years.
Knowledgeable horseman. Dad is an equine vet. The last two weeks the
Purina delivery has been late. He called around and was unable to
locate the feed we use (Sr./ Omolene 200, and Omolene 300). He
delivered something he says is comparable and is less expensive. The
sweet feed looks the same. The Sr. looks slightly different.
Does anyone have experience feeding Acco feeds? This dealer says Acco
is manufactured with Nutrena. Some feed goes into Acco bags and the
same goes into Nutrena bags. The sweet feed he brought today is made
by Livengood Feeds (All American 3000). It does look like the Omolene.
The labels are pretty much identical.
Any input into use of non "branded" feeds would be appreciated. Any
input on Acco vs. Nutrena?
They are both manufactured by Cargill out of Minneapolis. Cost is the
same. Our dealer is an Acco distributor, not a Nutrena distributor.
We want to stick with him because he delivers weekly which makes our
lives much easier, especially when we have 30+ horses here.
However, we have horses at all stages of development: pregnant mares,
weanlings, stallions, performance horses, dressage horses. All are top
quality. We don't want to hurt their performance or condition in any
way...
I am really worried about switching from something we have feed from
the early 90s....
Your input would be appreciated!
Judy
0 0
\_/

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Hair loss on tail from horse bite
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Routine Horse Care: Hair Coat Care: Hair loss on tail from horse bite
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Posted by Laura McGovern on Sunday, Nov 18, 2007 - 6:51 pm:
I just went down to ride my mare who is pastured with another mare & 2
geldings and she had a big horse bite on the base of the tail all the
way down to the skin. It had already started scabbing but all the hair
that was there was barely intact so i removed it and now she has a
bald spot about the size of a half dollar. Will her tail grow back on
this spot.

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Hives and pregnancy - HELP !!
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings: Bumps / Nodules / Warts / Tumors: Hives, Wheals, and Urticaria in Horses: Hives and pregnancy - HELP !!
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Posted by Susan K. Mangus on Saturday, Nov 17, 2007 - 7:22 pm:
Hi Dr. O - here we go again - after stabilizing our stallion and his
hives finally - now our best show mare - a 3 YO - has started hives
too. This began when she finished showing in mid September 2007. We
started her on oral Dex - 5 cc (2 mg/cc) initially and also
hydroxyzine. She did well and after 3 days with NO symptoms we stopped
the meds and POOF - back came the hives. The home vet wanted to try
Tri-Hist as an alternative (less costly than the hydroxyzine) and we
talked about Omega 3 Fatty Acid supplementation. BUT her bumps are
worse and she will not eat the Omega 3 fish oil tabs (opened). Tonight
we are going back on the hydroxyzine and increasing her Dex until we
have her stable. Our question is this - we had intended to breed her
this coming spring.... what does one do if a pregnant mare develops
hives ? Our equine specialist vet says the Dex and hydroxyzine are OK
during pregnancy, but the home vet says they are not. NB: mid
September when we finished showing the filly we stared MORE turnout
during the day, less feed, no more lunging, and no more daily washing,
no sheet on her during turn out. We are thinking the fly bites from
increased outside time tipped her over the edge perhaps ?? We are
really concerned that we might breed her, then she starts bumping up
again and THEN what the heck to do we do ??? Pregnancy is not a
problem with the stud but sure will be a mare !!
Susan K. Mangus

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Intra-articular administration of ethyl alcohol for arthrodesis
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Lameness: Joint, Bone, Ligament Diseases: Arthrodesis and Joint Fusion for Arthritis: Intra-articular administration of ethyl alcohol for arthrodesis
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Posted by Mary Rutherford on Sunday, Nov 18, 2007 - 9:22 pm:
Hi Ann,
Oh my goodness, I completely forgot to update everyone re: Caymann's
progress. It has been quite a nine months. Caymann had prolonged
postoperative pain following the surgery. He was off and on Bute, but
mostly on for seven to eight months after the surgery. I was unable to
do any work with him as he was even lame at the walk. So I think that
slowed our progress a bit. After a brief period of panic on both the
surgeon's and my part, I was finally able to start doing some light
work with him, but long lining only mostly at the walk with a little
bit of trot thrown in as tolerated. He really started to make progress
once I could start exercising him. We finally got him over the initial
hump about two months ago, he improved two lameness grades and can now
be long lined at the walk soundly with no Bute every day. He is now
making more rapid progress, the Distal Intertarsal Joint is almost
fused, the Tarsometatarsal joint is lagging behind a bit but much
improved. We injected the Tarsometatarsal joint with the alcohol again
to see if it would help move things along. We tried it before, but
sort of interrupted the process with the surgery once we determined
that half of the lameness was coming from the DIT joint. He is looking
better every day, and we still have two more months until the full
year is up. They are finding at CSU that it seems to be taking many of
these hock surgeries a full year to totally fuse, and that one joint
appears to fuse faster than the other. So at least Caymann is doing
something normal there. It will be interesting to see if the alcohol
helps him along.
We have had a rough go, but I think we are going to win the battle.
Thanks for your concern and reminding me to post our progress!
Mary

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Is this colic?
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Colic, Diarrhea, GI Tract: Colic in Horses: An Overview of Colic: Is this colic?
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Posted by leslie christian on Saturday, Nov 17, 2007 - 7:37 pm:
My mare is not eating her evening hay. She will go to her hay take a
nibble and then walk off... she keeps walking around her corral. She
isnt breathing hard. Isnt sweaty, Isnt kicking at her sides or looking
at her belly.
just not eating and pacing. She acted like she was in heat last couple
of days. lifting her tail etc.
thanks,
leslie

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Less Than Perfect
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HorseAdvice.com: Member's Services members_only: The Lounge: Kick back and relax.: Ethics and Animal Use: Less Than Perfect
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Posted by Nancy Kiester on Monday, Nov 19, 2007 - 5:36 pm:
At what point do we make the decision to stop spending borrowed money
on a filly who will never be ridable? Is the lesson here that we
should be more willing to put defective foals to sleep rather than
spend years hoping they might be made usable?
Stormy is very beautiful, sweet, trainable, could possibly even be
bred, but she has one foot that was injured at birth that probably
won't stand up to the added weight of a rider. But I have so much
invested in her--time and loving care as well as money--yet I know of
no one willing to give her a chance.
We consider carefully our choices when we are in the market for a
horse--we vet check and x-ray, ask our trainers and friends for their
opinions. But what about the less than perfect?

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Mare 4 months in foal showing in season (?)
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HorseAdvice.com: Equine Reproduction: Horse Breeding & Artificial Insemination: Pregnancy Diagnosis : Mare 4 months in foal showing in season (?)
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Posted by Imogen Bertin on Monday, Nov 19, 2007 - 6:46 am:
Hi Dr O
My mare was scanned in foal from a covering on 10 July. My
understanding of your article on pregnancy detection is that from day
90 to 180 (she just over 120 days at present) it is very hard to
detect pregnancy by palpation/ultrasound but I'm not sure if I have
that right.
She was showing possibly in heat the past week (when everyone's mares
seem to have been in season from the warm weather) but it could have
just been excitement on hearing the harriers out hunting too.
I would like to know because I am currently "minding" her and was
about to start on the pneumabort injections etc. next month - should I
request the vet to try to check if she is in foal or give the first
injection next month anyway and then check she is still in foal when
she gets to 180 days?
This mare does not show visually in foal until quite late normally. I
could not say if she is grass-belly or in foal just by looking at her.
Thanks for your advice as always.
Imogen

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Vet check revealed possible EPM
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Nervous System: Incoordination, Weakness, Spasticity, Tremors: EPM, Equine Protozoal Myeloencephalitis: Vet check revealed possible EPM
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Posted by Astrea on Saturday, Nov 17, 2007 - 8:59 am:
I have a mare out on approval and she passed all of the trainer
evaluations, etc... with flying colors. The vet suspects that she may
have EPM, though. She cross-cantered on the longe line, self-corrected
one way, but not the other. She showed weakness on both sides when her
tail was pulled, flexion test was slightly positive on one side in the
rear, and she failed to correct the cross legged test on one side. Her
back is sore in a couple of areas and she is stiff in the ribs on one
side. Her topline is noticably weak, which everyone thought was due to
lack of work, despite her being in work 4-5 days a week. This horse is
perfect for me in personality, training, talent, but I have two other
horses with debilitating medical problems. This was to be my easy, fun
horse. The owner is concerned about doing a spinal tap and is
considering having me put the mare on Marquis to see if there would be
improvement. I am concerned about the complications from treatment and
am very concerned that something awful might happen to the mare while
she is under my care. I really like the mare, but really don't
understand what the final prognosis will be. Does EPM mean that she
will not be able to hold up? She is trained as a Novice/Training level
eventer. Will she get better with treatment? Would she be safe?

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Washing a trailer
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Tips and Tricks: 2007 Add New Care Tips Here: Washing a trailer
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Posted by Jerre R on Saturday, Nov 17, 2007 - 6:14 pm:
Maybe everyone but me knows this, but since I just bought my first
trailer (yay!), I found this out from the dealer.
There's a commercial truck wash business next to the trailer lot, and
they're happy to do horse trailers.
Sure beats trying to reach the top of extra tall model!
Jerre

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Care Tips
By visiting our Care Tips section you might learn how to throw away that manure fork and replace it with a hammock! Maybe not, but if you post a great and original tip you can have time added to your membership and we will pick up the tab and that is almost as good.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/3/667.html

Training Tips
Members, horses not cleaning their own stalls yet? Better yet a little training tip that has made your horses behavior or your riding much improved? Best training tips get published in the newsletter and if your tip is posted you get 3 months added to your membership and we pick up the tab.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/7/668.html

Product Reviews
Have you found a great product you can no longer do without or how about a stinker that you want to warn other members about? We will publish the best organized reviews in the Newsletter and if yours is published we will add 3 months to your membership.
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/board-auth.cgi?file=/10/5544.html

Posted on Friday, Nov 16, 2007 - 9:01 am:

This newsletter offers a way to keep up with the horse information added to Horseadvice.com without overwhelming your email box. Posted every day or two this newsletter will highlight the new topics and discussions added to the main sections of Horseadvice.com. Note that replies to discussions, and some member's only posting areas are not displayed here. For a complete listing of topics and discussions please visit us at Horseadvice.com.

New Article: Cecal Impaction in Horses
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Colic, Diarrhea, GI Tract: Colic in Horses: Cecal Impaction: New Article: Cecal Impaction in Horses
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Posted by Robert N. Oglesby DVM on Wednesday, Nov 14, 2007 - 9:19 am:
Cecal impaction is a fairly common cause of colic accounting for half
the horses with cecal disease, 5% of horses with impaction, and as
much as 2% of horses referred to hospitals for treatment of colic in
areas where coastal bermuda hay is fed. The cecum in the horse is a
large blind sac that connects the small bowel with the large colon. It
is essentially a fermentation vat where microbes go to work on the
undigested fibrous portion of the horses diet...more.
Though experience is important a diagnosis of cecal impaction can
often be made on the basis of results of rectal examination. One of
the quandries with cecal impaction is what constitutes appropriate
therapy. Both medical and surgical therapy have been used with
success, it is not clear when surgery should be chosen and which
surgery is best. There have been management and medical procedures
associated with the development of cecal impactions. This article
discusses the clinical signs, diagnosis, treatment options, prognosis,
and prevention of cecal impactions. To access this article click on »
Cecal Impaction » above.
DrO

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Feeding Bute
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Tips and Tricks: 2004 : Feeding Bute
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Posted by Maureen Franks on Thursday, Nov 15, 2007 - 1:06 am:
They also make apple bute paste now. I dissolve my pills in water, and
add molasses, and then mix with their supplements. That works really
well also.
Moser

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Haarlem Oil
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HorseAdvice.com: Treatments and Medications for Horses: Alternative or Herbal Medicatons : Haarlem Oil
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Posted by Corinne Candice on Wednesday, Nov 14, 2007 - 11:35 pm:
Kami that would be interesting...not to get off the post but the idea
that there are urban legends and or potentially dangerous treatments
for horses (or that could harm the care givers) in horse care and
management is fact. I would be interested to see a post where they can
be discussed and debunked.
In relation to this post for instance and using potentially dangerous
products for horses, I have been using Nitrofurizone a few times to
keep a wound moist in addition to would care per HA since I am not
there every day as treatment....I was shocked to find out via a vet
tech the other day that it's carcinogenic (in lab conditions)when she
thought I got some on my hands, I didn't as i was using aseptic
technique but I did the product the day before so why would I ever
want to use that again and risk exposure to myself let alone put it on
my horses open wounds, which ironically was for open wound r/t cryo
for tumors. It's now in the garbage. I should have read the label more
closely. Turpentine I would love to hear how that one is beneficial.
v/r
Corinne

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Keeping a water clean
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Tips and Tricks: 2003: Keeping a water clean
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Posted by Maureen Franks on Thursday, Nov 15, 2007 - 1:30 am:
Hi -
You can also use a pool skimmer, they work great.
Moser

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PADRAIG
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Nervous System: Incoordination, Weakness, Spasticity, Tremors: Diagnosing Incoordination, Ataxia and Weakness: PADRAIG
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Posted by Jenny Astbury on Wednesday, Nov 14, 2007 - 3:19 pm:
Hi Dr O and everyone.
>From across the pond I check out your site regularly and recommend
everyone here to check it out.
Padraig is still going strong (in all senses of the word.....). This
year we have played at being dressage horses and picked up a few
points at affiliated level when we decided to be calm. Also done a
couple of unaffiliated horse trials this season and last week skipped
around a quite technical intro course. We are still having LOADS of
fun. Pad is now 21 (22 next Spring) and thankfully still totally sound
and fit. Who would have thought it after the 2005 episode!
I guess the message is as Dr O said to me earlier when I kept looking
for trouble after Pad seemed to be better:
"I would have a glass of Stout or a good Cabarnet daily and toast my
horse's good care and health."
I do, every day!!
Love Jenny and Pad XX



Grade 3 endometrial biopsy
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HorseAdvice.com: Equine Reproduction: Horse Breeding & Artificial Insemination: Preparing Your Mare for Breeding: Grade 3 endometrial biopsy
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Posted by Karen Feldman on Thursday, Nov 15, 2007 - 6:52 pm:
my daughter's mare has had to be retired due to a ligament injury; she
is an athletic mare, who was competitive at prelim level eventing, as
well as in the jumpers and dressage; her breeding is known- TB x DWB;
conformation, talent, personality- all better than good; she is a
healthy 15 yo.
Breeding physical exam was fine, cervix from past foaling was normal,
2 developing follicles on ultrasound; culture neg; biopsy done just as
she was coming into heat- revealed a grade 3;
Are there any options/treatments/clinical trials going on that she
would be eligible for, or indicating that a grade 3 isn't the "kiss of
death" for a potential broodmare?

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Iodine injections
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HorseAdvice.com: Treatments and Medications for Horses: Miscellaneous Drugs: Injectable Iodine: Hypodermin and McKay's: Iodine injections
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Posted by Geoff Stewart on Friday, Nov 16, 2007 - 4:47 am:
Hi Dr O.
I did ask a question recently about this. But I'd like to ask again.
I have two vets now indicating two different things here. Vet One went
ahead and injected. Vet two is now doubting wisdom of this as horse is
very sensitive in near side stifle, is running away from it and has
developed a very tight up rear action. Vet two wants to now inject
stifle with cortisone. Is that bad as you list it as a contradiction.
Vet will do this tomorrow. What do I do?
Regards
Geoff

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More ideas for 4H horse club?
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HorseAdvice.com: Member's Services members_only: The Lounge: Kick back and relax.: General Interest Questions: More ideas for 4H horse club?
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Posted by Michelle on Thursday, Nov 15, 2007 - 11:11 pm:
Hi
I teach 4H. In the winter we do books and projects and horse videos,
in the spring we ride! Our big hit projects with the kids have been
building saddle stands and sewing their own horn bags. Making horse
cookies was also really popular. Favorite horse games has to be the
egg and spoon race.
This year's biggest challenge is potentially 3 new members learning to
ride, none of whom own horses (sigh). It's pretty exhausting on a
leader to keep them learning without neglecting the other more
independent horse-owning kids with experience. Last year we worked on
horse show skills for the up and coming horse show participants in the
group. This year we are planning on doing cattle work.
Is there anyone else out there who can share some ideas? I'm always on
the lookout for something we haven't done before that will entertain
the kids and keep them having fun.

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The right farrier for my girl
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Lameness: Localizing Lameness in the Horse : The right farrier for my girl
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Posted by Deborah Greer on Thursday, Nov 15, 2007 - 9:05 am:
I recently moved my mare to a new barn, she settled in quickly, now
there is a new farrier. He came out last Weds and took Jazz shoes off.
When I came to see her, that night, I noticed how flat her foot was to
the ground, I noticed she had her entire sole touching the ground and
no hoof wall from the sides to the front were in contact with the
ground. It seems there is no side support for her hooves. On Weds
night she was walking a little cautiously, but by Sunday, she looked
like any movement would just be so excruciatingly painful, it broke my
heart. I buted her for three days. and now she seems to be walking
OK.I met with an Holistic Farrier, who recommended trimming her feet
again, with the toe coming all the way back to the sole line and she
would take out the flares on the side of Jazz hoof, we would then use
Easy boots to help her through the worst part and Bute her again. I am
so confused and worried that Jazz will be in so much pain for another
period of time, and that doing something as drastic as what is
suggested, will make things worse. I really respect this farrier, and
other horses she has worked with at the barn are sound. Please can
someone give me some advice. P.S: Jazz had a foal in May this year, so
her body and feet have gone through some changes. She also changed
feed when moved to the new barn.

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Care Tips
By visiting our Care Tips section you might learn how to throw away that manure fork and replace it with a hammock! Maybe not, but if you post a great and original tip you can have time added to your membership and we will pick up the tab and that is almost as good.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/3/667.html

Training Tips
Members, horses not cleaning their own stalls yet? Better yet a little training tip that has made your horses behavior or your riding much improved? Best training tips get published in the newsletter and if your tip is posted you get 3 months added to your membership and we pick up the tab.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/7/668.html

Product Reviews
Have you found a great product you can no longer do without or how about a stinker that you want to warn other members about? We will publish the best organized reviews in the Newsletter and if yours is published we will add 3 months to your membership.
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/board-auth.cgi?file=/10/5544.html

Posted on Wednesday, Nov 14, 2007 - 6:51 am:

This newsletter offers a way to keep up with the horse information added to Horseadvice.com without overwhelming your email box. Posted every day or two this newsletter will highlight the new topics and discussions added to the main sections of Horseadvice.com. Note that replies to discussions, and some member's only posting areas are not displayed here. For a complete listing of topics and discussions please visit us at Horseadvice.com.

"Thunking" sound when chewing
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Routine Horse Care: Equine Dentistry: "Thunking" sound when chewing
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Posted by Julie Masner on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 9:35 pm:
Weanling question d'jour: Six month old filly who is in good flesh has a very noticeable "thunking" sound when she chews. It's totally in rhythm with her chewing and seems to be coming from the temporal area. It's relatively loud. I have a feeling this can't be good! Is it something she may outgrow, or as I suspect, something more serious. My vet won't do farm dentals and I don't have her trained to load in a trailer yet. I'd appreciate your thoughts, Julie Use this link to go directly to the discussion: http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?3/212921

Fungal Keratitis Experience
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Eye Diseases: Corneal Ulcers, Fungal and Bacterial Keratitis: Fungal Keratitis Experience
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Posted by Carolyn Belcher on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 12:07 pm:
I thought folks might be interested in seeing how Lightning's eye turned out a year later. As bad as it looked, its hard to believe it resolved as well as it did. The scar has never caused any issues with our ridden work (i.e, no increase in spookiness or shying). [lightning eye2 11-12-07.jpg] [lightning eye3 11-12-07.jpg] [lightning eye 11-12-07.jpg] Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/94951

Haarlem Oil
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HorseAdvice.com: Treatments and Medications for Horses: Alternative or Herbal Medicatons : Haarlem Oil
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Posted by USHO on Wednesday, Nov 14, 2007 - 4:30 am:
I'm trying to figure out what this is. On the tube it also says juniperberry tar. Online I've found a sort of history of it: http://www.bottlebooks.com/questions/Oct2001/haarlem_oil.htm I've also found this site that gives a sort of ingredients and medical claims: http://www.bird-flu-avian-influenza-grippe-aviaire.com/en " Sulphur 16%, Pine turpentine 80%, Linseed oil 4%." I know trainers that swear by this for kidney problems. There's conflicting dosing anywhere from 1-2 times to daily for 2 wks followed by 2x/wk routine. Is anyone familiar with why/how this might be working for race horses in training? Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?5/212928

High Dose Vitamin E
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Equine Nutrition, Horse Feeds, Feeding: Vitamins for Horses, an Overview: High Dose Vitamin E
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Posted by IKE on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 10:40 pm:
Hi Dr.O,
I am curious of your thoughts on feeding a high(er) doses of Vitamin E. I have a 12yr.old Paint/QH in regular, moderate training level dressage work 5-6 days/week. (avg. 45-60 minutes including warm up & cool down). Almost 3 years ago he was showing signs of some relatively minor all over muscle tenderness. he would flinch a bit upon palpation...mostly through neck, over topline and hindquarters. Again this was relatively minor...he would not kick out or drop, but there was clearly some discomfort. His saddle was purchased for and fit to him by a very reputable saddle fitter and is reflocked 2x/year. Two seperate vets suggested a high fat/low carb diet. One of the vet's also suggested a high dose of Vit.E As much as 10,000 IU (ten thousand). I generally put him on 1-2,000 IU in the winter anyhow. But I increased it to the 10,000IU suggested. I live in the Northeast. (Mass.) I put him on this diet almost three years ago and he has been amazing. He is moving beautifully, is not sore like he was (maybe a little stiff in the back from time to time) and many comment on how flowing and supple he is when he moves. He eats as much good quality hay as he can clean up and gets a very small amount if Purina Athlete and Purina Equine Adult (3/4 CUP each 2x/day).He also gets a good joint supplement and mineral/salt block. I do not add Selenium. I would love your thoughts on this subject. Many Thanks. IKE. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?3/212922

Horse NQR at canter
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Lameness: Localizing Lameness in the Horse : Horse NQR at canter
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Posted by AT on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 7:32 pm:
For the last 3 days when I have ridden my horse he has been doing this weird hopping up step while cantering. He feels perfectly fine at the walk and trot and then once we start to canter every couple of steps he sort of hops up a little. He will only do it in the first direction he canters - and it does not matter which lead you start with - he still only does it in the first direction. He is a lazy horse and you do have to ask him to go forward with leg and spur. He seems to stop the hop step if you can get him going forward. After he has been cantering for a few laps around the ring it seems to stop. Any ideas what it might be? Stifle, hock, laziness? I had a lesson tonight and my trainer saw him doing it and thought it was more than likely laziness and that I should ride him forward when he does it. We also jumped tonight and he seemed happy and comfortable with the jumping. I have an appt with my vet on Dec 10 for a chiro check/exam but don't want to wait that long to have a vet examine him if this could be a lameness. Any ideas about what this might be would be appreciated. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/212920

Over at the Knees
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HorseAdvice.com: References: Equine Illustrations: Leg Anatomy and Conformation: Front and Hind Limb: Abnormal Conformation: Over at the Knees
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Posted by Marti Thompson on Tuesday, Nov 13, 2007 - 12:08 pm:
I have a 4 year old gelding that has been in training for the past year. He has now become over at the knees (both knees). It is not bone growth but the actual knee looks like it should buckle when he stands. This has just developed during the past 6 or 7 month. Does anyone have a clue if this can be corrected or what might have caused it. He has poor leg and hoof conformation to start with and this makes him look really bad. It does not seem to hamper his movement, but I fear it could in time, if not corrected. Any help is appreciated. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?21/212924

Research Summary: Very High Levels of Vitamin E Not Helpful
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Equine Nutrition, Horse Feeds, Feeding: Vitamin E and Horses: Research Summary: Very High Levels of Vitamin E Not Helpful
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Posted by Diane Baker-Hallowell on Tuesday, Nov 13, 2007 - 7:18 pm:
I currently supplement several of my older horses with 5000IU of vitamin E daily. One horse was tested as being very deficient in the vitamin, and showed much improvement in his hind end strength and flexibility when supplemented. Another mare is on 10,000 IU daily after experiencing some neurological and balance issues. She is also showing improvement, so I am hestitant to reduce her intake. Of course, I don't want to overdose any of them, or waste money on needless supplementation. Should I have the horses tested to see if supplementation is necessary? Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?3/169188

Tying up or something else?
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Lameness: Muscle & Tendon Diseases: Rhabdomyolysis: Tying Up, Shivers, PSSM, EPSM: Tying up or something else?
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Posted by Mason on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 11:15 am:
I need some direction on my horses condition as I am at a loss. He's a 13 yr old QH,easy keeper, has turnout 24/7 but had not been riden regular for about a year. Three weeks ago I had a trainer begin riding 2 times a week to get him some regular exercise thinking that would be good for him. He did great and I'd told the trainer that he had not been riden for sometime and to take it slow. She started out slow but the rides kept getting longer but he was doing fine. On the 6th ride, which was a Tues, when I got home I found out she had taken him up and down some hills during the ride. On Thursday evening when I went out he was sucked up in the flanks, and very, very sensitive to the touch, expecially around the flank, and under the back of the belly. So sensitive that his skin actually twitches when lightly touched and he moves away. I called the vet and he ruled out colic but told me to not feed that evening and walk him every couple of hours, which I did. My horse had no problem walking, had no temp and his breathing and heart rate were good. Its now been 4 days since the episode and hes still touchy in the flank area and seems still sucked up somewhat. Last night he was still very sensitive to the touch even on the sides of his belly and he still twitchs when touched. I live in Ca. Could he be deficient of Selenium, would that cause this? How much selenium does a 1000# horse require?. Hes on Platinum Performance, grass hay, salt and vit E. He is back to normal rations, but hes still very sensitive and I feel so bad for him. Sometimes he seems worse than others. Hes always been one to come up to be petted and loved on, now he moves away because he cant stand being touched. Any help or direction would be most welcome. Would blood tests help locate the problem? Thanks alot, Donna Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/212902

Value of Magnetic Therapy on Splint Bone Fracture
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HorseAdvice.com: Member's Services members_only: The Lounge: Kick back and relax.: Alternative Medicine and Epistomology: Magnets: Value of Magnetic Therapy on Splint Bone Fracture
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Posted by Wanda S. Bibens on Tuesday, Nov 13, 2007 - 10:47 am:
Hi Dr. O, What is your opinion on using magnetic therapy (wraps/boots) on a "simple" break on the middle outside of the right front splint about 3 to four inches from the end of the splint? Thanks for your help? Wanda Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?10/212923

Care Tips
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http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/3/667.html

Training Tips
Members, horses not cleaning their own stalls yet? Better yet a little training tip that has made your horses behavior or your riding much improved? Best training tips get published in the newsletter and if your tip is posted you get 3 months added to your membership and we pick up the tab.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/7/668.html

Product Reviews
Have you found a great product you can no longer do without or how about a stinker that you want to warn other members about? We will publish the best organized reviews in the Newsletter and if yours is published we will add 3 months to your membership.
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/board-auth.cgi?file=/10/5544.html

Posted on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 10:49 am:

This newsletter offers a way to keep up with the horse information added to Horseadvice.com without overwhelming your email box. Posted every day or two this newsletter will highlight the new topics and discussions added to the main sections of Horseadvice.com. Note that replies to discussions, and some member's only posting areas are not displayed here. For a complete listing of topics and discussions please visit us at Horseadvice.com.

Research Summary: Improved freezing technique for semen
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Equine Reproduction » Horse Breeding & Artificial Insemination » New Technologies in Equine Reproduction » Research Summary: Improved freezing technique for semen
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Posted by Robert N. Oglesby DVM on Thursday, Nov 8, 2007 - 8:03 am:
I am not sure what the directional freezing technique, based on a multi-thermal gradient (MTG) is but it looks hopeful for the hit and miss method currently used in horses for freezing semen. MTG appears to be a device that controls the temperatures during freezing. It appears to take the semen through a series of step wise temperature changes with the goal being to minimize ice crystal formation to preserve the semen cells. DrO

Reprod Domest Anim. 2007 Dec;42(6):610-615.
Directional Freezing of Equine Semen in Large Volumes. Saragusty J, Gacitua H, Pettit MT, Arav A. Institute of Animal Sciences, Agricultural Research Organization, The Volcani Center, Bet Dagan, Israel.
Despite its potential impact on the horse industry, sperm cryopreservation is not an established technology throughout the industry, for a number of reasons that include a reduction in pregnancy rate and increased cost per pregnancy. We have evaluated a novel directional freezing technique, based on a multi-thermal gradient (MTG), by comparing it with the conventional, controlled-rate cryopreservation method (CRCM). Ninety-seven ejaculates with >/=50% motility, collected from 31 stallions were each divided into two parts and subsequently frozen by either MTG or CRCM. Frozen samples were then stored in liquid nitrogen until thawing. The two treatments were evaluated by three methods: progressive linear motility (PLM), viability stain and hypoosmotic swelling (HOS) test. High correlation was found between the three evaluation methods for all post-thaw samples. Eighty-eight per cent of the ejaculates frozen by MTG had post-thaw PLM >/=35%, whereas only 59% of the ejaculates frozen by CRCM had such motility. Post-thaw evaluations of samples frozen by MTG and CRCM were: PLM - 50.2 +/- 1.5% and 37.4 +/- 1.5%, respectively; viability - 53.6 +/- 1.5% and 39.5 +/- 1.4%, respectively; membrane integrity, as evaluated by HOS - 36.2 +/- 1.3% and 26.5 +/- 1.1%, respectively. The differences according to all the evaluation methods were highly significant...Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?6/212815

Research Summary: Early embryonic loss risk factors
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Reproductive Diseases: Problems During Pregnancy: Early Embryonic Loss & Abortion: Research Summary: Early embryonic loss risk factors
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Posted by Robert N. Oglesby DVM on Saturday, Nov 10, 2007 - 9:53 am:
Early embryonic loss is usually defined as a loss of pregnancy after day 15 but before day 40. Though few surprises here this is a wonderful study that reviews risks factors for early embryonic loss in horses. In this study 75% occurred before day 26. In normal horses without any of the following risk factors the rate of EEL was almost 10%: Barren Mares 17% Age greater than 15 15% More than 10 past pregnancies 18% Breeding early in the year 18% Breeding on foal heat 24% Fluid remaining in the uterus after breeding 18% Twin vesicles 24%. For more see the article Early Embryonic Loss & Abortion.
DrO

J Vet Med Sci. 2007 Aug;69(8):787-92.
Factors concerning early embryonic death in thoroughbred mares in South Korea.
Yang YJ, Cho GJ. Equine Hospital, Korea Racing Association, Gwacheon, Gyeonggi 427-711, South Korea.
A total of 384 Thoroughbred mares were investigated to determine and evaluate the features of early embryonic death at nine equine farms on Jeju Island, South Korea, from 2001 to 2003. Overall, 771 matings for 384 mares resulted in 376 pregnancies 15 days after ovulation. Subsequently, 12.2% (46/376) of these early conceptuses were lost within 45 days after ovulation. Furthermore, about three quarters of the 46 embryonic deaths occurred between 16 and 25 days after ovulation. The incidence of embryonic death was highest in the barren (17.2%), more than 15 years old (15.4%), and more than 10 parities (18.2%) groups compared with the other groups (9.1-16.9%). Mares mated in March, April, and during the first estrus postpartum had higher embryonic death rates, (19.6%, 17.2%, and 24.6%, respectively). Mares with abnormal fluid and cysts in the uterus (18.0%) or multiple embryonic vesicles (23.1%) had higher embryonic death rates than those with normal uterine conditions (9.8%) or single embryonic vesicles (10.5%). The condition of mares, such as breeding condition and the environment of the embryo or fetus, are the major factors in relation to occurrence of early embryonic death. Use this link to go directly to the discussion: http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/212848

Research Summary: Initial events in black walnut laminitis
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Lameness: Diseases of the Hoof: Founder & Laminitis: Black Walnut Poisoning: Research Summary: Initial events in black walnut laminitis
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Posted by Robert N. Oglesby DVM on Saturday, Nov 10, 2007 - 9:22 am:
There have been suggestions made that MMP activation may be the primary event in some founders. In this experiment using black walnut extract to induce laminitis it is found early on that inflammation and endothelial activation preceeded the accumulation of MMP's. DrO

Am J Vet Res. 2007 Nov;68(11):1205-1211.
Early laminar events involving endothelial activation in horses with black walnut- induced laminitis.
Loftus JP, Black SJ, Pettigrew A, Abrahamsen EJ, Belknap JK.
Department of Veterinary and Animal Sciences, University of Massachusetts, Amherst, MA 01003.

Objective-To determine proinflammatory gene expression, endothelial adhesion molecule gene expression, and matrix metalloproteinase (MMP) concentrations in laminar specimens at 1.5 hours after administration of black walnut extract (BWE) and to compare these values with later time points. Animals-25 horses. Procedures-After nasogastric administration of BWE, anesthesia was induced at 1.5 hours in early time point (ETP) horses (n = 5), between 3 and 4 hours in developmental time point horses (5), and between 9 and 10 hours in acute onset of lameness time point horses (5). Anesthesia was induced at 3 and 10 hours after nasogastric administration of water in 2 groups of control horses (3-hour control group, n = 5; 10-hour control group, 5). Real-time quantitative PCR assay was performed on laminar specimens from control and ETP horses for cyclooxygenase (COX)-1, COX-2, interleukin (IL)-1beta, tumor necrosis factor-alpha, IL-6, IL-8, IL-10, MMP-2, and MMP-9 gene expression; and on laminar specimens from all groups for endothelial adhesion molecules, intercellular adhesion molecule (ICAM)-1, and E-selectin gene expression. Leukocyte emigration was assessed via CD13 immunohistochemistry, and gelatinase accumulation was determined by gelatin zymography. Results-Laminar concentrations of IL-1beta, IL-6, IL-8, COX-2, ICAM-1, and E-selectin mRNA were significantly increased in ETP horses, compared with control horses. Concentrations of IL-1beta, IL-8, ICAM-1, and E-selectin mRNA peaked at 1.5 hours. In ETP horses, leukocyte emigration was present in 3 of 5 horses and pro-MMP-9 was detected in 2 of 5 horses. Conclusions and Clinical Relevance-Results indicated that endothelial activation and laminar inflammation are early events in laminitis; MMP accumulation likely is a downstream event. Use this link to go directly to the discussion: http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/212847

Research Summary: Neuropathic EHV diagnosis
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Nervous System: Incoordination, Weakness, Spasticity, Tremors: Equine Herpes Encephalopathy: Research Summary: Neuropathic EHV diagnosis
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Posted by Robert N. Oglesby DVM on Saturday, Nov 10, 2007 - 10:47 am:
Here is a 24 hour test that is very reliable that diagnoses the EHV-1 strain most often responsible for the neurological complications. The problem with reporting these is we never know the availability of the test so if you are interested in finding where this is done, contact the M.H. Gluck Equine Research Center. Contact information is in the summary. DrO

J Vet Diagn Invest. 2007 Jan;19(1):69-72. Development of a real-time polymerase chain reaction assay for rapid diagnosis of neuropathogenic strains of equine herpesvirus-1. Allen GP. M.H. Gluck Equine Research Center, Department of Veterinary Science, University of Kentucky, Lexington, KY 40546-0099, USA. gallen@uky.edu
This communication reports the development and performance assessment of a rapid diagnostic test for identifying horses actively infected with the neurovirulent pathotype of equine herpesvirus-1 (EHV-1). The test is a real-time polymerase chain reaction (PCR)-based assay that uses EHV-1 pathotype-specific TaqMan(R) reporter probes for discrimination between neuropathogenic and non-neuropathogenic strains of EHV-1 in equine blood or nasal swabs. The diagnostic performance of the new technique was evaluated by testing specimens collected from 234 horses involved in recent outbreaks of EHV-1 myeloencephalopathy at three separate thoroughbred racetracks and one large riding/boarding stable. Side-by-side comparison of the EHV-1 pathotyping results yielded by the new single-step, PCR-based allelic discrimination technique (24-hour turn-around-time) with those generated by a multi-step, conventional nested PCR followed by nucleotide sequencing of the amplified DNA (4-day turn-around-time) revealed complete agreement between the 2 test methods. The ability to rapidly identify horses infected with neuropathogenic strains of EHV-1 using a single-step, PCR-based method has significant implications for future diagnostic evaluation of suspect animals. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/212850

Research Summary: Outcome of correcting incisor misalignment
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Routine Horse Care: Equine Dentistry: Research Summary: Outcome of correcting incisor misalignment
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Posted by Robert N. Oglesby DVM on Saturday, Nov 10, 2007 - 10:31 am:
Correcting diagonal incisor misalignments (unlevel where the teeth meet across the front) has become a standard procedure in equine dentistry with the idea it improves molar contact. Here they evaluate this assumption and it is not all positive. Some cases that do not respond to the procedure with improved mastication as measured by increased amount of molar contact. The bottom line seems to be: small corrections done early in the process work best but in advanced cases an improved molar contact can be hard to predict do to other problems and compensatory wear that has occurred. For more on this see the Unlevel Incisor subtopic in the article "Equine Dentistry". DrO

J Vet Dent. 2007 Sep;24(3):145-9. A retrospective evaluation of 204 diagonal incisor malocclusion corrections in the horse. DeLorey MS. Northwest Equine Dentistry, Inc., Kettle Falls, WA 99141, USA. nwequinedentist@earthlink.net
The goal of this retrospective study was to record the direction of the diagonal incisor malocclusion (DIM) and excursion to molar contact (EMC) distances both before and after corrective procedures to determine if any general trends were apparent which may aid in predicting the outcome of DIM corrections. Pre-correction and post-correction data were compared to confirm a benefit to the patient from the corrective procedure. The results of this preliminary study reveal a few general trends to serve as basic guidelines for the practitioner Lateral EMC distances to the left and right in cases of DIM are commonly asymmetric. When prudently performed, corrective measures usually result in increased symmetry of EMCs. In cases of DIM, the side with the shorter EMC is more likely to remain the same rather than change after DIM correction. Decreases of EMC in one or both directions are much more common than increases in EMC after correction. In 100-300 quadrant Dims, the EMC to the right will most likely decrease and in 200-400 quadrant Dims, the EMC to the left will most likely decrease. Despite these helpful findings, the data obtained from this study strongly suggest the existence of multiple etiologies and progressive compensatory mechanisms complicating precise prediction of correction outcome. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?3/212849

100 Kiger Mustangs for sale
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HorseAdvice.com: Member's Services members_only: The Lounge: Kick back and relax.: General Interest Stories and Discussions: 100 Kiger Mustangs for sale
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Posted by Chris Doyle on Friday, Nov 9, 2007 - 9:14 am:
I get Thehorse.com email newsletter and just noticed that these horses will be auctioned this Sat. Nov. 10th, in Oregons Wild Horse Corral Facility in Hines Oregon. I remember in previous threads on the mustangs several of you expressed how much you liked the Kigers- thought you might want to know about this. Sure doesn't give you much time- wish I had read this sooner. Go to TheHorse.com for more info.- do a search for kiger mustangs and you will get access to the article- sorry I am not able to put it here for you. Chris Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?10/212827

Asking your Vet for Doxy prescription?
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HorseAdvice.com: Treatments and Medications for Horses: Antibiotics and Antimicrobials: Tetracycline, Oxytetracycline, & Doxycycline: Asking your Vet for Doxy prescription?
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Posted by TOD on Saturday, Nov 10, 2007 - 8:11 am:
Hi Every one, do any of you have any experience getting your Vet to sign a prescription for Doxy to treat Lyme? I'm not entirely sure this is the treatment I really want to use, but you can order 500count 100mg tabs of Doxy from Smart Pak for $54.95 compared to $500 from the Vet, and seeing that my horse would need closer to 1,000 pills at a cost of $800+ it just doesn't make sense to pay such outrageously high mark up for an illness that 1) may or may not be the true cause of his "irregularity" 2) a disease that is so endemic to our area that he will surely become re-infected in the next few years and need re treatment. What have any of you done in approaching your Vet for a prescription, and any of you that have gone the IV OXY TET protocol, what where your results, how many years have you gone with out needing re treatment, etc...Thanks so much all of you, I'm really trying to decide where my money is being spent the most wisely in all of this. TOD Use this link to go directly to the discussion: http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?5/212846

Explain jumping saddle
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HorseAdvice.com: Training & Conditioning Horses: Tack and Training: Types of Saddles and Fitting: Explain jumping saddle
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Posted by Lori on Friday, Nov 9, 2007 - 7:41 pm:
Hi I have a few questions about jumping saddles. What are the advantages of thigh blocks? Does the length of the flap have anything to do with the length of your leg? Does more foreward have anything to do with how high you are planning to jump? Some people refer to a close contact, some have said hunter jumper type, is there a difference. What if you plan to do cross country? And anything else I should know before purchaseing a jumping saddle. Thanks Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?7/212845

Hock wound
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HorseAdvice.com: Diseases of Horses: Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings: Wounds / Burns: Long Term Deep Wound Care : Hock wound
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Posted by Karen Feldman on Friday, Nov 9, 2007 - 4:09 pm:
Dr O, this board is a great idea! My first time posting... My daughter's mare sustained an injury while competing this summer- luxation of SDFT L hock, torn at the medial attatchment. There was no injury to the bone or joint capsule, minimal soft tissue injury and it was a closed wound. We opted to do surgery- standing under sedation- to re-attatch the ligament, after which she was bandaged, placed in a 1/2 cast splint, and sent home on day 5. Well, it luxated again on day 6, causing much localized edema to that site; bandaging continue- changed by vet every 3 days; sutures were removed on day 15, and the next day, the incision dehissed; open wound was debrided, dressed with topical silver sulfazine cream, until recently when it mostly receives topical dermalog and a telfa dressing; one vet feels it will not progress in its healing with out pinch or punch grafts (about 30 needed); As she will not be able to return to competition, and broodmare career won't happen as her endometrial bx came back grade 3, and she is not insured at this time, we are trying to provide the best care for her in the most efficient/ecconomical economical way; IF grafts ARE needed, then they are needed. If not, what would be reasonable to expect? some more recent pix are included. Would love your input. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?4/212834

Looks like blister - tooth erupting?
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HorseAdvice.com: Horse Care: Routine Horse Care: Aging Horses and Incisor Anatomy: Looks like blister - tooth erupting?
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Posted by Imogen Bertin on Monday, Nov 12, 2007 - 2:05 am:

Hi Dr O
My 2 1/2 yo horse has a point on her lower gum about an inch behind the front teeth that looks like a large blister (about half a cm, slightly oval in shape) and she is chewing anything she can find in the field eg tree stumps. After reading the article, and given her age, am I likely to be correct to assume that this is just the central incisor erupting on one side? There is a very faint mark on the other side of the jaw at the same point but it might just be a variation in colour in the lower gum. Do both usually arrive together or can one be before the other? Thanks Imogen Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?3/212899

Loosing my MIND and HOPES in UTAH!
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HorseAdvice.com: Member's Services members_only: The Lounge: Kick back and relax.: General Interest Questions: Loosing my MIND and HOPES in UTAH!
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Posted by Sarah Peterson on Sunday, Nov 11, 2007 - 8:35 pm:
For the past two week I have been struggling to improve the stables and get Terry's name out there only to be yelled at, disrespected and unappreciated as a person. He is driving everyone away with his rude comments and constant complaining. After having a meeting with my husband and me him he made the comment that all he needed was someone to do mucking! Why did he hire me, why have I been spending all this time working so hard, why was he paying me more (to easy his conscious for his behavior)? I worry for the safety and health of the animals. I don’t think I can even board my horses there because going back would have me constantly wondering if they (not just mine) are ok. I’ve been waiting, years to get back into horses and found the perfect place to start, my kids where excited and my city slicker husband was starting to Cowboy up. This has been such a set back. Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?10/212898

Need bit/bitting advice
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HorseAdvice.com: Training, Behavior, & Conditioning Horses: Tack and Training: Bridles and Bits: Bridle Topics Not Covered Above: Need bit/bitting advice
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Posted by Lee Canning on Sunday, Nov 11, 2007 - 7:59 pm:
Hi All,
I’m looking for some advice/feedback about putting a horse back into a bit after being ridden in a mechanical hackamore for a couple of years. I just purchased a 5 1/2 year old QH gelding that has the quietest, kindest most wonderful disposition. He has not been used much at all since he had 30 days on him as a 3 yr old. He has been used as a recreational trail horse (ridden western) and although green, he’s pretty much unflappable and very tolerant. These are the reasons I bought him as I wanted a safe and sane horse for my VERY beginner husband. When I tried him out, I asked why he was in a hackamore, as opposed to a bit. The reason was, he was fussing with the bit to the point that it was really annoying, so being that the owner was riding her other horse with a mechanical hackamore, she decided to try it and he was so good that she didn’t bother with the bit again. I know the trainer who put 30 days on him, so I talked to her about him and she said she had him in a medium thickness jointed egg butt snaffle and he was fine. She suggested maybe his teeth were bothering him, but he has always been up to date with them (his wolf teeth were removed when he was 2). The trainer felt it would be better to put him back in a mild bit if a novice is going to be riding him. I noticed his steering needs work and I am not experienced with a mechanical hackamore, but it appears it might be kind of a confusing tool to teach a horse to turn with. It seems to me something better suited to a horse that knows how to neck rein (which I want him to do eventually). Also, he raises his head when he backs up or stops (with minimal rein contact) and I think it might be easier to teach him balance and get his head down with a bit. Anyway, today I put a snaffle on him and he was tolerant of it, but not comfortable – which I expected some chomping and head twisting at first, but he carried on for the whole ½ hr the bit was in his mouth. I’ve bitted young horses before and usually after a few minutes they relax (maybe he just needs several sessions...). I did not ride him with the bit, I just did some flexing from the ground. I don’t want to tie his mouth shut with a cavesson, because if the bit is truly causing him discomfort, I think that would be cruel. One thing I noticed about him is he has a short, wide head, with a fat muzzle and a big jowl (he is foundation bred, maybe those are characteristics of his breeding...?). When viewed from the side, his mouth looks 'short'. When I adjusted the bridle so the bit sat at the corners of his mouth where one would typically sit, it was like it was too low and maybe banging his incisors. When I adjusted it tighter, it just looked all wrong - too many creases in the corners of his mouth, as though an inexperienced person bridled him. In either place it sat, it just was not cozy for him. Has anyone else heard of this, where possibly the conformation of his mouth is not going to allow for a bit to sit properly? Has anyone had this experience and found a bit that works? I want him to remain happy and to continue to enjoy being ridden, so any suggestions would be appreciated. I wondered if he might be a candidate for a bitless bridle. He has a good whoa and he is not at all excitable. Thanx, LeeC Use this link to go directly to the discussion:
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/show.cgi?7/212897

Care Tips
By visiting our Care Tips section you might learn how to throw away that manure fork and replace it with a hammock! Maybe not, but if you post a great and original tip you can have time added to your membership and we will pick up the tab and that is almost as good.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/3/667.html

Training Tips
Members, horses not cleaning their own stalls yet? Better yet a little training tip that has made your horses behavior or your riding much improved? Best training tips get published in the newsletter and if your tip is posted you get 3 months added to your membership and we pick up the tab.
http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/7/668.html

Product Reviews
Have you found a great product you can no longer do without or how about a stinker that you want to warn other members about? We will publish the best organized reviews in the Newsletter and if yours is published we will add 3 months to your membership.
http://www.horseadvice.com/cgi-bin/advisor/board-auth.cgi?file=/10/5544.html