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Discussion on Intranasal Vaccinations | |
Author | Message |
Member: Brock |
Posted on Wednesday, Jan 14, 2004 - 2:04 pm: I just read the article about Intra-nasal vaccinations. Apparently this is a relatively new 'live flu' vaccine that is being administered in addition to the regular 2-way flu/rhino vaccine. My two horses live in an almost-too-sterile environment. I am taking them up to our local (warm) indoor riding arena next month. I will be vaccinating them within the next 2 weeks with the regular 2-way and I have also been advised they should receive the intra-nasal vaccine as well.I am a little nervous about administering this myself. Any pointers? This is something many of us will have to get used to doing. For example, how far up the nostril does the tube go? The article says to apply the vaccine slowly and then says 1 second. That, to me, is not slow! I think I'll get my friend out to give me a hand. Does anyone have any tips/comments? |
Member: Lala |
Posted on Wednesday, Jan 14, 2004 - 2:56 pm: Put a larger barrel sized syringe on it so it pushes more air and hence vaccine goes in farther, and hold head up after administering it, a la worming or syringing in liquid into mouth.The tube goes up the nostril so that you have the barrel of the syringe sticking out. I would say you want to be in and out of there as quickly as possible while ensuring you get it all up as far as possible so not wasted or back down on you. Oh yeah I haven't seen one of mine sneeze with it but maybe someone has a tip for preventing this happening. Friends are always useful, even if just moral support, but also for holding and perhaps shielding an eye so you can sneak it into one nostril! Best of luck, I envy you the warm arena. |
Member: Goodie |
Posted on Friday, Jan 16, 2004 - 9:48 pm: Here are a few comments and ideas, take what you need and toss the rest...1) Why are you double dosing your horse for flu/rhino? The FluAvert IN is supposed to be used instead of the IN Flu/Rhino shot. 2) Play with your horses' muzzle a bit to get them used to you touching it. Then take a gentle hold of the muzzle on either side and squeeze gently. Twist lightly in the opposite direction of the nostril you want to use and place the tube along the inside of the nose (closest to the middle), if you are too far to the outside, you will feel the tube stop against cartilidge. Once you slide up the cavity (they might pull a bit but just move with them calmly) push the plunger and release the muzzle. Then hold the head up for a few seconds (I use scratching their throat and jaw as a reason). While scratching their jaw/muzzle, gently rub their muzzle too (I give kisses on the muzzle to distract them). 3) I use this method on everything from my babies to a 17h Race horse at 1250lbs who is just off the track. It takes a bit of practice and patience. It is the same type of grab as a twitch but without the pain or tool. It also seems to help find the cavity. Just follow the inside edge of the nose straight up! The only recommendation I have is to always be quiet and talk silly love talk to them. If I don't talk sweet, I can't do anything! I have actually used this method in a pasture without a lead rope. Less stress and it's quick and painless. 4) I haven't had anyone sneeze out the IN but I have seen seepage if I don't hold the head up for a few seconds afterwards. They will sneeze later but I haven't seen anything come out. 5) I would just like to know how they know that this application actually works. That is a long passage way and a really short tube. Good Luck! T |
Member: Brock |
Posted on Monday, Jan 19, 2004 - 3:23 pm: Thanks for the tips Fiona and Taara. A good question - why is my vet suggesting double dosing? Do you have any insight into this, Dr. O? I will ask her this week when I pick up the vaccines. The vet assistant I talked to about this on the phone seemed to think they needed both for added precaution. Am I going overboard on these vaccinations? |
Member: Lala |
Posted on Monday, Jan 19, 2004 - 6:15 pm: You are very welcome, Taara had great advice and very clear directions, a verbal diagram on how to hold the muzzle.I can only shot in the dark speculate, no pun intended, about the double flu vaccs -- that they cover different strains?? My horses are in a similar isolated situation, only see about four other horses a year (and that's only when they come over for occasional trail rides so really no nose to nose or greater contact) and only contamination from vets and farriers, and my vet only does the one vacc, the rhino is IM and the flu is IN. One or more may go off premises this spring/late winter and I'll be inquiring about vaccs before we do so. If I learn anything illuminating I'll let you know. Curious to hear what your vet has to say. Best of luck, Fiona |
Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Monday, Jan 19, 2004 - 9:58 pm: Hello Pam,I have a whole article of advice on giving nasal vaccines, see the article associated with this forum titled, Intranasal Vaccine Administration. If you have any question about the information let me know. DrO |
Member: Goodie |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2004 - 10:05 pm: Dr. O, Does this mean that you don't think I am administrating the meds correctly?Everyone else: The farm I run gives flu/rhino shots on a EOM (Every Other Month) or E2M schedule, depending on age and use. I am not sure why but I do know that these seem to be the least snotty/sick horses I have ever delt with. Pam: Have you had the chance to try administering? I still don't understand the concept of IN but as long as I do it right, the horses don't really seem to care. One less needle as far are they are concerned. I do have one Gelding that I own who has decided that head over 8' high is the perfect way to avoid mom and the "TUBE". He didn't like it when I stood on a hay bale and played with his head for a bit then gave him the IN. He wasn't expecting that. I love that we can still be sneaky regardless of how long we have owned the horse. |
Member: Goodie |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2004 - 10:29 pm: OK, a few questions. After reading the application process of IN's I am a bit lost. Is the dorsomedial blind pocket the firm "cartilidge feeling" blockage on the outside of the nasal cavity? And if so, another words: one must place the tube on the inside cavity of the nasal passage as I stated in my previous post. I never thought of holding the nose with my hand while "injecting" the vaccine. Most of my horses get a little snappy with their nose being held down but they don't seem to mind me holding their muzzle. Do I just have weird horses? |
Member: Goodie |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2004 - 10:32 pm: Oops, one more question... What is a ventral nasal meatus? Is that the open cavity on the inside of the nose, closest to the bridge of the nose? |
Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Friday, Jan 23, 2004 - 9:13 am: Hello Taara,I did not see anything wrong with your first post Taara and if you are able to introduce the whole tube into the nostril you are getting it far enough up then delivering the vaccine rapidly you are doing fine. The ventral meatus is simply the continuation of space defined by the nostril as it continues back to the pharynx. The blind pouch can be fond with your finger by exploring the inside of the upper part of the nostril and if you are in it you will not be able to advance the whole tip. DrO |
Member: Brock |
Posted on Monday, Jan 26, 2004 - 2:08 pm: We did it! I'm sure glad I had a friend with me, though. I don't think I could have done it alone. First, she held the head and I tried to administer but I was too tentative. We switched places and she was more successful (she's a little more experienced than I, but she had never done this before). Anyway, the only problem we had was, we did the IM vaccinations first (flu/rhino and tetnus/ss) and when it came time to do the IN it had started to FREEZE and wouldn't come out (it is VERY cold up here in Canada)! So, we had to go back into the house and let it thaw. It wasn't frozen solid, just enough at the tip to prevent it from coming out. So, all in all, it went pretty well. They're good to go and can't wait to get into that warm riding arena and get us all into better shape! |
Member: Tangoh |
Posted on Tuesday, Jan 27, 2004 - 2:00 pm: Hi Pam! I just had to comment on the weather here in SK! So is it like -51 in MJ too? How are your horses coping? Ours are fine, they don't even WANT to go into the barn, they're covered in snow and ice but are staying warm by keeping constant vigil over the hay feeder and seem to be drinking a lot more water than usual, I wonder why? We've thrown about 3 feet of straw in a sheltered corner and they like to hang out there rather than go inside. I heard it's supposed to get down to -60 with the windchill overnight tonight! All I can say is BRRRRRRRRRR.....bring on the longjohns. Winter's here in true Saskatchewan form! |
Member: Suzeb |
Posted on Tuesday, Jan 27, 2004 - 3:45 pm: Hi Pam,Comment on the intranasal: My guy doesn't like them so we use a friendly twitch to get the stuff up and in there. It does work. Hi Sherri, Winter is here in true form. To put these temperatures in Fahrenheit or Imperial Units is this: -52ºCelcius = -57ºFahrenheit. This is with windchill factor, otherwise it is a balmy -36º. I suppose anybody with a Stallion might find them in the gelding department if this keeps up . Good to hear your gang is moving around. Susan B. |
Member: Brock |
Posted on Tuesday, Jan 27, 2004 - 5:39 pm: Hi Sherri: Yes, it is damm cold here -- I really don't think it can get any colder. The horses are just fine; almost oblivious. I'm convinced they prefer this weather to July when they have heat, flies, mosquitoes and other pests to contend with. We keep two box stall doors open in the barn that access the outdoors. They are in and out and they, too, have lots of straw to cozy up in. I can't wait to get into that nice arena and get back in the saddle! Stay warm.Hi Susan: Thanks for the advice. We were prepared to use a light twitch, if necessary, but they were pretty good. Thanks for everyone's advice and input. Here's hoping I have no colds/flu to deal with when they are exposed to their buddies. |
Member: Sparky |
Posted on Monday, Feb 2, 2004 - 2:48 pm: Pam - my vet told me to feel for the nasal passage first - so I stuck my finger up his nose and felt around and got the picture in my head. There is definitely a dead end and an opening - once I had felt the opening I knew I was in the right place when giving the IN. When giving it I actually held his muzzel on the side of application and put my finger up his nose and then guided the tube in the right passage with my finger. He was ok with the whole thing and did not sneeze. It all just takes practice and is pretty hard when you only do it once in a while.Janet |