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Cheryl Hohler
Member
Username: Chohler
Post Number: 205
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 1:18 pm: |   |
Please ignore the other incorrect post my puter keeps change post topics on me.
Hi all,
I know there was a recent discussion with tetanus, but I would like to share a recent experience.
I work at a local ranch and yesterday evening I got a call from someone new to horses, and new to the area, that had a colicing horse and she didn't have any money to call the vet and wondered if I could just take a look at her filly and recomend anything.
Upon arriving I found the filly in one of the worst rental corral situations i have ever seen. The filly was in great distress, I gave 5cc's of banamine trying to get her comfy. She had a temp of 105.9 and I think it would have gone higher but thats as high as my thermometer goes. She has rapid respiration, dark gums, and cloudy unresponsive eyes. I couldn't get her off the ground. I told the people that this filly was in really bad shape and she needed medical attention immediately, and that if money was an issue i would take care of it and they could pay me back. I know the vet so I called him at home and told him the vitals, and I needed him right away and that I couldn't get her off the ground.
When the vet arrived and we got her off the ground, the neurologic problems were well evident. And he was able to confirm tetanus at the office. We put the filly down in my trailer and I disposed of her.
This filly hadn't been vaccinated, because they believed that it could wait till later this spring. The corrals where this horse was keept are unclean, and rusty wire pieces and other crap was evident without having to look for it. All kinds of illness that we don't see often have been know to pop up at these corrals.
This filly suffered for 2 days. Which was mostly lack of knowledge on the owners part. But she suffered for 2 days with tetanus that might have been preventable with proper vaccination.
While things can happen anyways with the horse vaccinated it is not often. Reactions to vaccines are not often either.
For those that question vaccinating for tetanus let me tell you that the process of this illness is not pretty it is down right UGLY!!!!!! If you love your horse please vaccinate!!!!! Even if you have nice clean corrals Please Vaccinate.
Cheryl Hohler |
Cheryl Hohler
Member
Username: Chohler
Post Number: 210
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 2:16 pm: | |
DrO,
Sorry this brought to mind that I haven't been vaccinated for a few years. I have a cut on my hand but didn't touch any contamination sources except rubbing the horse's sweaty face.
Should I vaccinate now or wait till my yearly physical in june where they will give me a tetanus shot.
Thanks |
Fran C
Member
Username: Canter
Post Number: 210
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:00 pm: | |
Cheryl,
Get vaccinated ASAP. Couple of years ago, I thought I broke my arm after a fall off my horse. The ER doc asked if I had been vaccinated for tetanus and I hadn't been since I was a kid. He said anyone with any exposure to horses should ALWAYS be current on tetanus. Unfortunately, I don't remember how often that means you get to look forward to a shot...and come to think of it, that was more than 6 years ago since I had my last shot, so it's likely I'm due for one too!
Fran |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 554
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:13 pm: | |
imo - do as Fran says and get one ASAP. You probably need only a booster shot and if I remember right you should get a tetanus every 5 yrs? and a booster whenever there's exposure ie stepping on a nail at the barn. Anyone know for sure on frequency? |
Holly Wood
Member
Username: Hwood
Post Number: 601
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:19 pm: | |
Sara, I was going to say, "10 years," with a booster upon injury . . . Someone, please correct us if we are wrong. |
Judith K Volkar
Member
Username: Choicyki
Post Number: 3
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:30 pm: | |
People medicine I KNow...Tetanus booster is once every 10 years once initial series has been done. Mortality from tetanus runs as high as 30 percent in adults and 60 percent in neonates. Pregnancy is not a contraindication to tetanus booster. Once every ten yearsis not so bad!!!! |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 555
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:39 pm: | |
I know some shots we get are good for 10 yrs. and some only for 5, but I forget which are which. Help someone? |
Cheryl Hohler
Member
Username: Chohler
Post Number: 212
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:41 pm: | |
I was vaccinated 7 years ago, my job requires I get a new vaccination in june at my physical. I just don't know If it is imperrious that I get one now. |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 556
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 3:43 pm: | |
Holly, I just looked it up; you are right. A booster every 10 years. There are several good articles on www.webmd.com and do a search for "tetanus." One article points out that the bacteria are also found in dirt, and about 1/3 of cases are gardeners who were unaware of the dangers of tetanus. It can enter the body through even just a scrape on the skin. |
Imogen Bertin
Member
Username: Imogen
Post Number: 644
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 5:24 am: | |
This post relates to humans and tetanus not horses. If you had 3-4 vaccinations during childhood and teenage years up to age 21 you are covered. The US recommendations are out of date with current research. The UK recommendations are that once an adult human has achieved full coverage no further boosters are needed even if the patient is exposed to tetanus.
Please be aware that a very rare side effect of tetanus vaccination in humans is Guillaine Barre Syndrome - an autoimmune condition where your body attacks its own myelin sheathing causing paralysis which can last weeks or months. I have had this. You don't want it. It is rare but it does happen.
Best wishes
Imogen |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12507
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 9:17 am: | |
It is not as clear cut as that Imogen. Current UK policy on immunisation for tetanus is that five doses of vaccine probably provides sufficient protection as long as high-risk wounds are managed with tetanus immunoglobulin.
(Commun Dis Public Health. 2004 Dec;7(4):283-6.
Tetanus immunisation policy in England and Wales--an overview of the literature.
Bracebridge S, Crowcroft N, White J.
Health Protection Agency, East of England Regional Epidemiology Unit).
Note the qualifier "probably" and the needs for additional therapy in cases of high risk wounds. The real point of this article was to point out there are still real questions about vaccine recommendations. Concerning the Guillaine Barre Syndrome association, I can find it very rarely associated with polio and influenaza vaccination, and one case following the use of tetanus antitoxin. The antitoxin is not the same as the vaccination (the toxoid) but the immunoglobulin referred to in the UK recommendation above.
DrO |
Linda Lashley
Member
Username: Lhenning
Post Number: 64
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 10:18 am: | |
This topic brings another thought to my mind, which is the need for a benevolent program to help low income people care for their animals medical needs. I know many would say, if you can't afford the animals care, then you should not own them, but sadly, that is not the reality. Too many horses, dogs, cats, etc are mistreated with poor care by people that mean well, but simply cannot afford to have them vaccinated. It seems if there were help out there for vaccinations, spaying, neutering, etc. we could reduce a lot of animals suffering and at a lot lower cost then trying to cure major diseases. Does anyone know if such a program exists? |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 558
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 12:21 pm: | |
In this area and where we lived in norther California, their were mobile, low cost clinics put on either by the humane society, or by local vets that were for inexpensive vaccinations and neutering. California even had the clinics, vaccinations only, for horses. I just assumed this was a standard for all areas. Have you checked with your local humane society or animal controll and local vets? |
Fran C
Member
Username: Canter
Post Number: 211
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 1:50 pm: | |
Many humane societies have some sort of help for low income people. For example, the humane society in Boston, MA has the Angell Memorial fund. And I know United Animal Nations out of CA has a low income assistance fund. However, to my knowledge, these types of programs usually reward grants to 'emergency' cases where the illness is catastrophic and life threateneing (such as a dog getting hit by a car). There are income qualifications and usually these programs require that the (small) animal is spayed/neutered.
For anybody needing assistance, it's definitely worth checking with your local humane society and I know my small animal vet will work with people who can't afford their animal's care in terms of payment arrangements |
Cheryl Hohler
Member
Username: Chohler
Post Number: 215
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 3:20 pm: | |
In my area keeping horses is a lot more affordable than most but there is no assistance available and basically no way to help animals that would be clear cut cruelty cases in other states. I just watched a horse die from cruelty and ignorance and there was nothing I could do.
However on an interesting note in wyomings constitution it is still worded that a man can be hung for stealing a horse. Granted this will never happen but the wording hasn't been changed since the state constitution was written.
I decided to wait till my physical to get vaccinated as I didn't get a wound from a direct contaminated source. I just examined the horse and took sanitary measures.
I just wanted all to know how cruel this illness was and to vaccinate their horses. In 25 years of dealing with horses this was the worst thing I have ever witnessed and I hope to never see it again. |
Jean Sheiness
Member
Username: Ladera
Post Number: 29
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 10, 2005 - 1:10 am: | |
Oh my !!!!
I am a registerd NUrse. It is so much easier to prevent tetanus than treat it. Usually the out come is a fatality. PLease get the shot NOW.
The public health department in Santa Ana California reccomends all personnal invloved with horses have a tetanus shot every five years. LAy people can have the shot every ten years.
WHen in doubt when the last tetanus was given WE ALWAYS innoculate. It is less invasive, less painful than contracting tetanus and less costly. Tetanus attacts the nerves so your muscles seize. Tetanus is also called lockjaw disease. I have seen it in drug addicts. It is not pretty. The longer you wait to get the shot the less effective the shot. WHy? Because the shot prevents the disease. Waiting until a physical will not help . Go to your local public health Deparment. The vaccine will costs under twenty dollars |
Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 684
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 10, 2005 - 6:03 am: | |
Hi, all,
I believe proper care of horses is more of an educational matter than a financial one.
In the area where I live there's hardly one horse owner who can't easily afford proper care. Yet vaccination and deworming are allien practices. Dental care is unheard of. Bute is an exotic drug. And so on...
A couple of years ago, if you wanted to vaccinate your horse you had to buy wholesale (pack of ten) directly from the company. Local vets wouldn't sell you just one because the remaining nine would just expire in the fridge.
Even when you unavoidably purchased the lot, people wouldn't let you vaccinate their horses for free and you had to eventually throw the remaining vaccines away.
Then a well known stallion died to something called tetanus. Wow! New word, you could hear it everywhere around a horse for a couple of months.
Now horses get vaccinated two-three times a year. You'll probably find vaccines in almost every horse owner's fridge by now. Nobody wants to give the impression that he's unprepared for this new disease, or that he doesn't care for his horse.
We're now working on the deworming issue. One of the local vets got the idea, and now he brings only ivermectin products for one year and only moxidectin products for the next. Quite a progress. Praziquantel we don't have yet, but we'll get to that, over time.
Slowly, very slowly, local folks start to realise that a horse is not necessarily old and sick by the age of twelve. They start to realise that -emotions apart- it is much smarter and very much worth it to keep your young one rideable for 15 or 20 years instead of 5 or 10.
Christos |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12532
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 10, 2005 - 9:35 am: | |
Neat story Christos. I saw with my own eyes what happened when we switched from benzimadazole dewormers to ivermectin, it added 7 to 15 years to their lives and eliminated what was the common cause of death in old horses, thromboembolic colic.
DrO |
Stephanie Dunkin
New Member
Username: Stephdbr
Post Number: 1
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 11:38 am: | |
My first post.
The tetanus vaccine is a pretty sensative subject to me right now.
A month ago, I had to put down the love of my life, my only horse, my beautiful show horse - a 10yr old that I raised from a 5-month-old - after developing serum hepatitis from a tetanus antitoxin vaccine. He spent 2 weeks in the hospital with help from all over the country to save him and he just couldn't fight anymore and became totally toxic. He slipped off after I stopped asking him to fight, looked into his eyes when I got the last moment of coherence, and said - you can let go now, I'll be okay.
I've been pretty angry at the tetanus vaccine. He was kicked at a boarding stable I had him at while I built better stall doors during our bad storms for him on the new place I moved to. The kick was bad, and got worse late at night and I was not informed by the caretakers, or vet, when he was taken to the vet for stitches. The vet didn't know the history of the horse but protocol of a kick calls for the vaccine.
Serum hepatitis is a side affect of the tetanus antitoxin vaccine. Rare but documented. Didn't know that but I do now.
The makers of the vaccine have been tremendous through all of this heartache staying with me in communication all the way through it. Even crying with me.
If I had to do this all over again - if I was informed of the emergency vet visit and asked to make the call on whether to vaccinate or not, I would have said "Absolutely yes, vaccinate with what you feel is protocol even if this horse is always current on his vaccines. The tetanus risk from a dirt pasture wound is so much greater than the risk of reaction to the vaccine.
I think my heart will always flip over for the rest of my life - when I do get another horse - if the horse gets injured and must recieve the tetanus antitoxin vacccine. But, darn sure - the horse will get the vaccine if it is called for. Actual tetanus is a terible, terible thing that I feel, we as horse lovers, don't have to put our loved ones through. Veterinarians and the pharamaceutical companies assured us of this.
DrO: I am an editor for a breed specific, monthly, full color magazine. You have helped me and countless members of my breed by your generosity in making articles available for publication. I just wanted to take a moment and thank you for the good you are doing. Horses truly are a gift - it's so warming to see what appears to me to be the same attitude from you.
And thank you to all of you. I don't converse much - I read, and I have enjoyed and learned so much from the threads. Thank you. |
Alicia Kost
Member
Username: Aannk
Post Number: 439
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 12:10 pm: | |
Stephanie,
I am so sorry for your loss 
Alicia |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 672
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 12:26 pm: | |
Stephanie, I'm so sorry you lost your horse. What an awful experience. What an eloquent post. I do agree with your sentements; tetanus is truely horrible for both animals and people. Do you know the incidence of this type of reaction? I've never heard of it before this. |
Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 833
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 1:01 pm: | |
I am deeply sorry for your loss, Stephanie. |
Liselotte F. Bradford
Member
Username: Lilo
Post Number: 163
Registered: 4-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 2:02 pm: | |
Stephanie,
What a sad story. My deepest condolences on losing your special horse.
Lilo |
Stephanie Dunkin
New Member
Username: Stephdbr
Post Number: 2
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 2:15 pm: | |
Thank you all so much for your posts. I thought I was doing better but this post I made ripped it all up again. I really am devastated and live in such a dead gray world right now. But have faith it won't last forever.
Sara, I don't know the actual documented cases. I've heard he was the 5th known case by some, and higher by others since the vaccine. Maybe DrO can help us here. I'll bet it's low though, otherwise I would think veterinarians would be highly verbal with the precautions to owners.
It's just an awful thing all around - something meant to protect him, destroyed him. He really was an incredible horse (my dream) - even flew with me when I moved to Hawaii - the first documented Paso Fino horse to the Islands. He had a wonderful, dearly loved life. I did my "effortless" job very well.
Thank you all so much. |
Holly Wood
Member
Username: Hwood
Post Number: 630
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 2:53 pm: | |
Stephanie, thank you for sharing your story and heartache with us. You have a host of empathizers here on The Horseman's Advisor. Hold fast to that thread of faith while you grieve for your friend. The grayness WILL lessen, and the memories will grow more precious and will lend you wisdom, humor and hope as you heal and get ready to give your love to other horses that need a good owner and a home. There IS healing, and venting to friends is one of the best ways to heal. Be good to yourself . . . after the night, joy comes in the morning. |
Aileen
Member
Username: Sunny66
Post Number: 807
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 3:37 pm: | |
Stephanie, you gave me goosebumps...I'm so very sorry for the loss of your obviously well-loved friend. Many (((Hugs))) to you. |
Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 835
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 4:46 pm: | |
Please, all, review the article on tetanus to the last paragraph.
It's under: Equine diseases>>Nervous system>>Incoordination, weakness, spasticity, tremors>>Tetanus
DrO, I think there's need to differentiate toxoid from antitoxin more clearly in the article. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12934
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 5:04 pm: | |
Hello Stephanie,
My sincere condolences, I too have seen this result from the use of tetanus antitoxin.
I must clear up a misconception above, the antitoxin is not a vaccine but a concentrated source of preformed antibodies to tetanus. This is not a problem with the vaccine, just the antitoxin. For more on this see either the article on Vaccine Overview or a more complete description at Equine Diseases » Colic and GI Diseases » Mouth, Esophagus, and Liver » Liver Disease and Failure. In the article it is called Theiler's Disease.
Lastly, thank you so much for your kind words, it makes it all worth while. Hopefully your post will be seen by many others who now will keep their tetanus vaccines current and so will not feel the need to use the antitoxin.
DrO |
Cheryl Hohler
Member
Username: Chohler
Post Number: 250
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 5:10 pm: | |
Stephanie, I am so very sorry for your loss, I am praying for you to be comforted at this time/ |
D.
Member
Username: Dyduroc
Post Number: 130
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 7:07 am: | |
Stephanie, I'm very sorry about your loss and will keep you in my prayers.
Your generosity in sharing your story is greatly appreciated. Not only did I learn something important but have also discovered my mare is NOT current on her tetanus vaccine (an oversight that will be corrected ASAP). Thank you for the wake-up call!
D. |
LL
Member
Username: Frances
Post Number: 110
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 9:46 am: | |
No wonder you are heartbroken, Stephanie: what a sad, sad story. You have all my sympathy.
Lymm |
Little King Ranch
Member
Username: Eoeo
Post Number: 167
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 10:48 am: | |
Thank Goodness, we have never had a problem with tetanus. We always give FT Dodge 5 way that contains tetanus in it. We also cover the flu and rhino with that at one time. If a horse gets hurt, I either give a 5 way to boost it or a tetanus toxoid since they have had tetanus toxoid in the 5 way. So sorry about your loss. It is devastating. I got the halter yesterdayin the mail that was on the filly we put down that had the choke last December. It really rocked me. Kind of them to return it but brought back fresh memories. EO |
