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Discussion on Holy bugs! | |
Author | Message |
Member: mysi |
Posted on Thursday, Jun 5, 2008 - 8:04 pm: Wow, NC sure has alot of bugs!!! I know the heat has just hit here but my horses are COVERED in flies! Mostly the annoying ones, non biting. But there are these biting knats that are flying around their ears too. They are in fly sheets, fly masks, sprayed down, etc...etc...etc... and I use the fly predators. as Dr. O says in the article none of the sprays are effective for too long.I control the manure, I spread it daily and drag it 2xweek. There are no flies in the barn, but only all over the horses. I've never seen anything like it. So I think I'm going to swap their schedules, but I do have a stupid question...what about wild animals getting in and attacking the horses? I live in the country and I hear about coyotes. I am also concerned about Moose running around in the dark and hurting himself. Do they see ok at night? Aren't mosquitos bad at night? I never worried about this stuff in S. FL., we had tiny pastures and no wild animals. |
Member: canter |
Posted on Thursday, Jun 5, 2008 - 8:30 pm: Hi Melissa,Coyotes are unlikely to attack a mature horse. All the horses where I board are turned out 24/7 except in bad weather. There are lots of coyotes here as well and the horses (and 1 very small pony) have never been attacked (before I boarded there, they bred a few babies, too, and the babies were never attacked, although I would be more concerned with a young foals safety around coyotes). The horses see just fine in the dark and in the winter, when it gets dark early, I often rely on Sparkles helping me to get her back to her pasture and stumble back to the barn without her. I believe the mosquitos are worst at dusk, so if you turn out after dark, they should be a little less bothersome to the horses. |
Member: scooter |
Posted on Thursday, Jun 5, 2008 - 9:39 pm: Oh those nats, my horses ears were bleeding from them. I was late, but if you wipe swat on their ears and some on the hairs that go to the inside the nats stay away for at least a couple day...unless it rains it off. I also put swat on their tail heads (they quit itching their butts immediately) the nat seem to like that spot too, and I also smear it all over their bellies, sheaths, and udder, depending on sex of course. The horses look forward to their "swatting" and it works great.As far as wildlife, I have seen coyotes go through the pasture during the day, the horses didn't even lift their heads to look at them. The coyotes are horrible around here, I see tracks going through the horses paddock when there is snow on the ground. Last night the dogs were going nuts in their pens so I got the spot light out and there was 3 fox in the horse pasture...they could care less. Like Fran said unless you have a weak sickly, or very young foal I wouldn't worry unless NC has wildlife we don't have I've never worried about it. Night vision seems better than their day vision IMO. Mine navigate all the electric wire pens I have everywhere. The flags are even blown off. They seem to learn there boundries quickly. |
Member: hpyhaulr |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 6:49 am: Melissa,I was going to PM you about this and ask if you were getting this as badly. I am using the predators every 3 weeks, AND feed through IGR, Fly trap bags hanging all over the place (they are full in 2 weeks). I have switched out their schedule as of the beginning of this week. In during the day,out at night, but I have zero coyote problem (afraid to post that and tempt the wildlife gods!)The minis I keep in at night, just to be on the safe side in case of a pack of dogs. Fly masks and spray down with bronco.... it is exhausting and wildly expensive. I was not sure the feed thru was working til I ran out this week and could not get to Rockingham for more.... HOLY JAMOLIES!!! It WORKS!!! I have increased my predator order to a full colony since the new girl got here... for all that, I STILL have flies and the gnats are awful, and I couldn't find anything to do about them! I don't have a fly mask on the haflinger as her forelock is as good a fly mask as anything I could buy. I switch them out as my pasture (turnout now, no grass anymore with the DrOught) has no shade, the barn is a sheDrOw and not so enclosed, daytime temps have been hitting over 100 and I worry about heat stroke. I have to get all this done before 11 am so I don't have the heat stroke! lol I think part of the problem is that we had 4 'visiting' horses here for almost a week and they of course had not been on the IGR, and that is when the flies multiplied. Exponentially. What is swat?? I will check with my feed store tomorrow and see if they carry it! Do you think the high humidity is the cause? In talking to a couple of other local horse owners, they agreed, they have never had such a bad fly problem before. But they just shrug their shoulders and rhetorically ask "What're you gonna do?" If I answer that, I get sour looks, I learned to shut up. |
Member: scooter |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 7:03 am: https://www.horse.com/Farnam/Pest-Control/Farnam-Swat-Fly-Repellent-Ointment-BUL2 2.htmlMy old girl can't stomp the flies off of her back legs, I rub swat on them and she stays fly free all day...it can attract dirt, but I prefer the dirt to the flies and nats and so do they |
Member: hpyhaulr |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 7:18 am: I just read Dr. O's fly control again...I can say I have noticed an unhappy difference since we put the mats in the stalls. It seems the stalls with mats and bedding have more pests hovering very low to the ground. Is 'swat' that roll on I use on their ears??? Our fans are situated too high to effect them, but out of the 'danger' reach for the horses...I guess I have to do a better cleaning job in those stalls! They get done daily, sometimes twice a day. I will focus on that now. I am late getting out there. It will be 100 by noon, gotta get crackin'!!! |
Member: hpyhaulr |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 7:21 am: Great... thanks for the link DIane! |
Member: mysi |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 8:56 am: Cyndy it's nice to know this isn't just the norm around here. I definitely think the 90 degree weather has caused it, I didn't have an issue until then.Swat is great, and I'm going to use more, I never thought to use it everywhere. I only use it on their noses, around the eyes and ears. It comes in a jar, every feed store I've been in carries it. Dr. O says vaseline works just as good and it is alot cheaper, I'm going to pick some up and try it too. I guess I won't worry about the critters of the night. I put them out last night, I leave Moose free to roam everywhere but the others were in the pastures. I came out this morning and Patches had broken out of her pasture, through the fence boards that are lined with metal mesh fencing, through the electric wire. That horse really tests my patience. (I've posted about her destructivness). I'm ready to send her back to her mom. |
Member: muffi |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 9:52 am: patience ladies. the Predators take a few months to take control of the situation.also if you can get out there a few times a day to scoop and remove the poop. I scoop 3 x a day and spread adn smash the balls. but in Northern NM we haven't had much in the way of bug trouble lately. Coyotes? the horses just think they are dogs. I lived in h AZ where we have huge packs and they just wandered thru the arena to drink in the waterer's that's all I ever saw. so don't worry a bout them. Its the Cats I fear now. a neighbor had a horse that we think was killed - not so much by an attack but by fear of one. He must of reared up in the middle of the night hitting his head on the top of his stall and smashed his skull and died as a result of that. poor baby. poor cowboy too. his best gelding. but that would be all I would be worried about - but, i think if the horses are out in groups of 2 or more, and have room to roam - a largish area - then they can run and or protect them selves against anything. my boys (I only have two) are out 24 x 7 all the time even with the cat around. |
Member: mrose |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 10:55 am: If your mat seams aren't sealed,and mine aren't, you do have to do a very good job cleaning. Also, I find that using PDZ or a similar product sprinkled in the areas where the horses like to urninate, really cuts down on odor and thus flies.I've tried the fly predators here, and it is so dry in the summer they don't seem to do very good. I've had to make damp spots for them. Luckily, our fly season doesn't start until mid-summer, but we do have gnats in the evenings which are starting now. They seem to arrive when we start irrigating. What kind of fly sheets have any of you had good luck with - ones that don't tear easily and that work. When you put swat on their tails, do you work it down to the hair ends, or just rub a little on at the tops of their tails? I use it on their ears and "belly buttons" but haven't tried it on their tails. |
Member: jowidner |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 12:16 pm: Gosh Muffi, the idea of cats certainly strikes fear in my heart. There are reports of them in the Virginia mountains but none here near Richmond where I live. I think I would go insane with worry. Is there anything that can be done to protect your horses? I guess wherever we live we learn to accept the risks that come with the territory - both figuratively and literally!Melissa, we used to have coyotes, actually they were called coydogs because they were coyote-dog mixes, when we lived in southern Indiana. I had a wonderful wise old mare at the time, and I remember watching her chase them from the pasture. She had had several babies in her lifetime, and I think she was just naturally extremely protective of her turf even those she didn't have a foal at the time. Yes, the flies and temps are rotten right now. We went from a beautiful spring with lovely weather into August type weather practically overnight. I too have just changed to the night turnout schedule. Some folks around here have hung big heavy plastic strips over their stall doors and windows to protect from flies and create more shade in their barns and run-in sheds. I have considered this but it seems that it would cut down on the air circulation and so I'm not sure that it would be worth the trade off. I guess it would depend on the design of your barn or run in. |
Member: scooter |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 2:21 pm: Sara I massage a generous dose into their tail heads, along with a "plop" right at the top...if it doesn't rain (fat chance around here) it lasts about 5 days. |
Member: mysi |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 2:26 pm: Yeah JoAnn, it was an overnight change in weather. I literally went from putting a sweatshirt on one morning to a tank top next next day and drenched in sweat.Sara,On Moose I use a Rambo Fly Protector Fly sheet. Its a softer weave but super durable. On Sweetheart I use a Baker Fly sheet and have had it for 8 years and it got its first tear this year and I'm pretty sure her buddy ripped it for her. Patches came with one and I'm not sure what kind it is but its terrible. I spray my barn and keep the stalls clean so I have no bugs (barely any) in the barn, it's only outside. I spread the new manure daily. I guess it just happened so fast and it's so much more than I am use to. |
Member: kbaxter |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 2:44 pm: I live in Scottsdale, Arizona and this is the first summer with horses in my backyard and I am blown away by the flies and gnats too. I clean my stalls twice sometimes 3x's a day. I use Fly Predators and feed Solitude IGR. Have been using the IGR for 3 weeks now and am seeing a difference. I also have tons of fly traps with the liquid bate. I have a dumpster outside my property that I dump the manure in a good 500 yards from the barn. My barn is modified malibu mare motel..meaning I have malibu rails top and bottom with a 3ft tall panel in between to act as a wind break. The wind out here can get pretty fierce and wouldn't you know those pesky flies just hang on for dear life..they must have little hooks in their feet to keep them from blowing away. As for coyotes, there are several packs around here and they do jump my 6ft no climb fence. They leave behind evidence (poop) amongst where my dogs go. So far they haven't been any trouble and my horses have reacted at all...but there are Raven's out here too and they leave their "kill" in the horses water buckets daily (half a lizard, gutted frogs and lunches from the workmen out in the area) I have to change out their waters nearly every day. As for stall mats I have 5 stalls and only one of them has mats and I would have to say that stall has the least amount of flies so I am saving up to mats all my stalls. |
Member: chrism |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 5:08 pm: At one farm, the horses are on night turnout and wear fly masks that cover their ears. The barn has a pyranna fly spray system to help control the bugs in the barn.At the other farm, the horses can go in/out at will, so wear the fly masks and move about. This farm uses predator releases to keep flies down. Both barns have fans and the horses stand in front of them often. Both barns have mats. Both have manure piles pretty far from the barn. One harrows and the other has pick up from local farmer for fertilizer. We are in central NC. I have seen a coyote once, but not recently. Recent wildlife sightings are deer, fox, groundhog and assorted birds. Oh and put up a bat house and a purple marten house for natural predators. Ticks have been the worst this year. |
Member: hpyhaulr |
Posted on Friday, Jun 6, 2008 - 8:10 pm: Muffi,It took me til now to figure out why you were concerned about Cats!!!! I am thinking kitten barn partrol....clearly you are referring to larger predators...lions & tigers & bears, oh my! Kim, we found a local paper mill which was switching out their conveyor belt..... Got a couple hundred feet on a HUGE roll for $100...it took 4 guys and a tractor w/ spear to get it off the flatbed, but still a bargain.... we did 7 stalls, the aisleway and have enough to get the wash stands done when he gets back from this trip. One more item on the "honey do" list!!! |
Member: muffi |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 10:55 am: Hey Kim - I used to live in Rio Verde and we had Mare Motels - I put Mats down in the inner feeding area and (ok I am AR) I swept them when I fed the horses - and I kept the dust and sand out of the eating area. (I Swept the dirt down to hard pack) it kept the flys away from the Shaded area - mostly. Oh Yea they got in there - those suckers, but the matts really helped a lot.Now I have a full barn with stalls and stuff (in northern New Mexico)- Matts again an so far no flys. But what I do now is no shavings in the barn for the summer - and guess what guys - Yea - NO FLIES! I use preditors and clean poop 3 * a day but yea - mid june and NO FLYS. My neighbor up the forest has them. So who ever said it first I AGREE! Matts help. but I didn't seal mine - they are over sand so if/when they pee in the stalls it leeks into the sandy bottom. *and no Cyndy - NO Tigers but definatly Lions (mountain kind) and bears! Oh MY! |
Member: lilo |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 11:48 am: Hi all of you who use Swat -I use it on my mare's tummy where the biting flies congregate, and on wounds. Using it all over the horse to fight flies - does that get kind of expensive? How long does a jar last (my jar is pretty small)? I agree the stuff is effective, but was wondering about the cost. Thanks, Lilo |
Member: jowidner |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 2:59 pm: Hmmm, so Muffi, you don't use bedding at all during fly season? What about the urine? I have unsealed mats over gravel too, but unless I put down sufficient bedding the pee puddles on the mats. My stalls open into paddocks, so I wonder if I took out the bedding completely if they would pee out in their paddocks instead of in their stalls? Certainly would be nice to save on bedding AND have fewer flies. |
Member: scooter |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 3:02 pm: Hi Lilo I only use it on the trouble spots...belly, tail head, sheath, udders, ears more for the nats and those stupid belly flies, whatever they are? I blame the cows for them. If it doesn't get rained off it seems to be effective for at least 3 days. In a normal summer I only go through 2 jars for 3 horses. Sometimes I do the old mares back legs as she has problems with arthritis and can't lift them well to get the flies off. |
Member: scooter |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 3:07 pm: JoAnn mine don't pee or poop in their lean-to when there is no bedding. Yesterday I put bedding in, because of night time lock up (they have a small pasture and paddock) and talk about flooded this morning. I never use bedding in the summer unless they are locked in....what a savings in labor and $$$$. |
Member: annes |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 5:48 pm: Diane, this year we have cows for the 1st time and I was worried about an increase in flies. So far I haven't noticed too much of a difference - I was hoping the cows would attract all the flies from the horses - my husband sprays the cows often and he feeds the mineral with fly control. The cows have their own barn and water source but they are in the next field from the horses. I think I am doing everything I can for the horses but I really hate that the cows may attract more of the critters! |
Member: scooter |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 11, 2008 - 10:53 pm: Ann we just keep a few heifers up by the horses and I haven't noticed the horses having more flies, actually just the opposite, maybe they do attract them away from the horses. The heifers are covered where the horses have very few, other than the swat for the nats I haven't had to use fly spray or masks yet, where as before we started keeping the heifers by the horses I sprayed and masked in late April....of course it could be coincidence, but last year was the 1st year the bots weren't around and it was the 1st year we kept the heifers there? Kinda odd I don't think bots go on cows, so why is a mystery. |
Member: muffi |
Posted on Thursday, Jun 12, 2008 - 9:48 pm: yes this is the first year of no bedding - I read about it HERE FIRST!!! I have two geldings that hate the splash - so they seek the out of doors to pee. I wish that one of them (And I know who you are Midnite!!!) Would Poop out side too then it would be just clean with hay on the floor. :o)We feed all you can eat -constant Grass Hay. but in the stalls on the mats, so they come in there out of the sun & Wind to eat. so all I have to clean up is about 3 times a week I sweep up the fines that cover the floor so it doesn't get too dusty there. Go ahead and try it! I kind of like it! They have soft dry ground to sleep on so I am not depriving them of that. I mix Wood Chips (small ones) & Sand in to their arena area attached to the stalls. |
Member: hpyhaulr |
Posted on Friday, Jun 13, 2008 - 7:39 am: I got a bag of lime and have found an improvement when I clean out the stall, I dust the pee areas with the lime after I have cleaned out the bedding and before I sweep the mats. It is making a difference. I think I have to use bedding as they are confined from about 10am-8:30 pm. I wish I COULD eliminate the bedding which costs me about $150 a month! It was much worse before the mats went down!If I am wrong, PLEASE tell me!!! |
Member: ajudson1 |
Posted on Friday, Jun 13, 2008 - 9:05 am: I don't use any bedding year round. Not unless a horse is sick or injuried. I do though, give generous amounts of hay when I stall the horses for a period of time so in affect they have bedding.My stall floors are a deep layer of sand, 3/4" gravel over that, and a paper mill salvage product that is a tough woven nylon material. It does drain somewhat but it gets plugged as time goes on so it doesn't drain the best. Once a year, I take the flooring out, level the gravel, apply lime, hose the nylon off with a pressure washer, and put it back. It works pretty well and you can feel the give in the gravel/sand when walking on it. I'd never have any horses if I had to buy bedding! And what to do with all that? I have no place to store it, and have enough manure already to get rid off without more with bedding in it. And yes, my horses insist on peeing in the stalls that I leave open 24/7. Only one gelding will hold it as long as possible when locked in and go outside. The other 3 are a bunch of piggers. I wish I could convince my husband to extend the roof out so the horses could completely be locked out of all the stalls. BUGS...many years ago I bought some Wendal's Garlic to feed the horses. Well, they didn't care for eating it, so I started spreading it in the stalls. This was an old 3 sided shed, dirt floors, nothing enclosed. It sure seemed like the flies lessened with the garlic smell in there. DrO thought I must have "special flies" or something like that when I posted here, but hey, it's worth a try. |
Member: ajudson1 |
Posted on Friday, Jun 13, 2008 - 9:14 am: I don't use any bedding year round. Not unless a horse is sick or injuried. I do though, give generous amounts of hay when I stall the horses for a period of time so in affect they have bedding.My stall floors are a deep layer of sand, 3/4" gravel over that, and a paper mill salvage product that is a tough woven nylon material. It does drain somewhat but it gets plugged as time goes on so it doesn't drain the best. Once a year, I take the flooring out, level the gravel, apply lime, hose the nylon off with a pressure washer, and put it back. It works pretty well and you can feel the give in the gravel/sand when walking on it. I'd never have any horses if I had to buy bedding! And what to do with all that? I have no place to store it, and have enough manure already to get rid off without more with bedding in it. And yes, my horses insist on peeing in the stalls that I leave open 24/7. Only one gelding will hold it as long as possible when locked in and go outside. The other 3 are a bunch of piggers. I wish I could convince my husband to extend the roof out so the horses could completely be locked out of all the stalls. BUGS...many years ago I bought some Wendal's Garlic to feed the horses. Well, they didn't care for eating it, so I started spreading it in the stalls. This was an old 3 sided shed, dirt floors, nothing enclosed. It sure seemed like the flies lessened with the garlic smell in there. DrO thought I must have "special flies" or something like that when I posted here, but hey, it's worth a try. |