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Discussion on Need advice on fly repellents for sesitive skin | |
Author | Message |
Member: Cpacer |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 10:34 am: I moved my horse to a new barn last weekend and he got covered in insect bites the first day he was there. I’ve since had them start spraying him before turnout, but he’s got a lot of really itchy spots. He’s sensitive to bites and most sprays and RepelX is the only one I’ve found so far that doesn’t give him a reaction, although I’m worried now about having to apply it so often, it might.I’m wondering if putting calamine lotion or hyDrOcortisone cream on the bites might help with the itch? Anyone have any advice on what to put on? I’m assuming it’s not good to give him a nice scritchin on these spots like he wants? After I saw all the bites I went onto ValleyVet.com and ordered a few new products to try out on him. One was an all natural eucalyptus/tea tree based product and the other was a spot on containing 45% Permethrin. I do have a concern about the spot on and the way it absorbs – if I put it on and he has a reaction will I be able to wash it off, or will it be stuck in his skin? I did just read the bug article in this forum and saw that it labeled these products a waste of time, so who knows, maybe I’ll just send them back and not risk it. Has anyone with a sensitive skinned horse tried the 30% DEET as the article suggested? How were the results? |
Member: Kathleen |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 10:58 am: CP,My daughter's gelding is/was sensitive to fly sprays. He would break out in hives. We use "Bronco", it's in a yellow bottle, and he's fine with it. I spray twice a day with the gnat problem right now. When my mare had reactions to insect bites, I used benadryl spray. It seemed to help. Kathleen |
Member: Banthony |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 11:43 am: CP,I moved my thoroughbred to a barn once that had a swamp on part of the property. He immediately got bites all over him even though I was using a good fly spray. He was so miserable and itchy that he was violently rubbing himself on any edge of the stall he could. Unfortunately, in my zeal to protect him I used so much fly spray that he had a systemic reaction to it. He lost all the hair on his neck and hindquarters and I had a huge vet bill over it. And instructions not to use any thing but a natural product on him until he cleared up. Those kinds of products did no good on him under those circumstances. My poor horse was sensitive to fly sprays for almost a year after that. I did find that giving him a bath and then giving him an oil rinse afterward helped tremendously. You put a good splash of baby oil in a bucket of warm water and then sponge it all over. You can scrape off or let air dry. It does make them a little oily but it puts a layer of oil on their skin and the fly spray sits on top of that and doesn't come in contact so directly with their skin. For bad bites I have had some success mixing DMSO with benadryl cream and 1% cortisone cream and rubbing that in. |
Member: Cpacer |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 11:46 am: The knats were pretty nasty the other day. He was covered with them on his (not so) private parts, and had little blood specks. Those seem to be better now, but his neck has the bulk of the big bites.Just realized I made a typo too -- article says 25% DEET not 30% (wouldn't want to misquote DrO) |
Member: Cpacer |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 11:55 am: UGH Linda, that's what I'm afraid of. There was one "for sensitive skin" product that I rolled around his eyes once--gave him some very funky looking bald circles around his eyes, looked like he was wearing glasses. Baby oil bath -- wonder if that might promote sunburn if he's turned-out? |
Member: Banthony |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 12:33 pm: Good question, CP. My horse is a bay and he had lots of trees so I didn't even think of that. I was in Georgia when that incident happened.I am in Florida now and the bugs are terrible here too. I am using Tri-Tec. It is ridiculously expensive and I laugh at the 14 day claim, but it does work and he doesn't react to it. I use it at least once a day. |
Member: Cpacer |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 1:18 pm: Just got a call from the stable and apparently he's now covered in hives and has a swollen eye. Running down to meet the vet there now...Any more advice on sensitive bug products welcome! |
Member: Canter |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 1:24 pm: cp, your only alternative may be to use a fly sheet. It won't protect all of him, but at least a good portion of his skin will be covered.I hope he's OK! |
Member: Annes |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 3:16 pm: Have you tried the Dawn dish liquid/vinegar/water recipe that has been posted here before? I've been using it now for a couple years and everyone I give the recipe to has reported that it works for their horses. When my TB got hives once, the vet told me to give him banamine and by the next day his hives were gone. |
Member: Banthony |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 3:32 pm: CP -I hope your horse is OK. He is losing the insect war.Just a guess - but my horse has come in with a swollen eye many times - he may have gotten stung on the eyelid by a ground wasp or something similar. The first time it happened to my horse, Rumor, his eye looked so bad I thought he had gotten hit in the eye or something. His eye was huge and swollen shut. The vet came out and checked for a scratch but didn't find anything. He gave him some Bute and Banamine and had me put an ice pack on it. After about the third time this happened I learned to put an ice pack on it and give him some bute and banamine myself. A fly mask helps but I've had him come in with a swollen eye even when he's had a fly mask on. And I've had him come in stung 3 nights in a row! Evidently there was some stinging insect where the grass was particularly tasty. Rumor has also had quite a few episodes with hives. Both from fly spray and from insects. Last summer he sought shelter under a big oak tree during a terrible thunder storm and the storm washed a nest of red ants onto him. I saw him shoot out from under the tree and start throwing himself on the ground. It took me awhile to figure out what was going on but he had huge mounds of hives from his ears to his tail all over his back, withers, etc. The vet came out and gave him a shot of Recovr RX and I had him on bute and banamine for almost a week. It took him 3 weeks before he was back to normal and he was miserable the whole time. We have a filly now that has hives from something she is eating. We can't figure out if it is something in the new hay or something she is finding in the pasture. Good luck. Sometimes it takes quite awhile to clear hives up. I hope your horse isn't too bad. |
Member: Cpacer |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 8:06 pm: okay, I think we're alright now, or at least on the path. The Doc gave him a steroid injection and banamine, and put some green stuff in his eye that came out of his nose (I didn't know those little holes were there!). Also some eye ointment to use and Azium powder (not cheap stuff) to put in his food starting for twice a week while the allergens are high.We figured it was allergies, but we're not doing any tests to find out exactly what to (probably the bites). DrO, he said that Pyrethrins are not known to cause allergies cause they're so mild--would you agree? I didn't realize there were 2 similarly named ingredients, Pyrenthrin vs. Permethin, but they're quite different I guess??? |
Member: Sswiley |
Posted on Friday, Jun 2, 2006 - 9:24 pm: Isn't it fun having sensitive skinned horses. I call my mare the "princes and the pea". She reacts to most fly sprays and starts itching her skin bloody every year. I was never sure whether she reacted because her coat is so fine or because she is allergic. Her coat is so fine it seems that the fly spray soaks right to her skin.Larry's horse spray is very gentle. You do, however, have to put it on and re-apply it daily. I put it on heavy and brush it into the hair. the ingredients are mineral oil, Aloe oil, and the following fragrances:cedarwood oil, citronella, eucalyptus oil, and worm wood oil. Then there is Freskamenthe and Octyl Methoxycinnamate what ever that is. It is sometimes hard to find so you could probably try mixing some your self. You dilute it 1-5 with water for use. |
Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Sunday, Jun 4, 2006 - 10:00 am: The idea that something that just because something is natural that is will not cause reactions totally ignores most of nature. Nature is constantly devising ways to protect itself and these are often direct irritant reactions. After all the fly bites your horse is reacting to are natural. It also ignores the whole branch of medicine involved with allergies. Animals often develop allergic reactions to natural substances.Though pyrethrins seem to be low on the direct irritant scale we have had horses reported on these boards who have reactions to the "spot" products. Pyrethrins are a class of chemicals that are associated with chrysanthimums and permethrin is a man made member of that class. CP sometimes with exposure the body becomes less reactive but sometimes worse. If your horse remains this sensitive to fly bite reactions you will have to manage the situation as described in the article, there will not be a repellant product that will allow you to apply once in the morning and turn the horse out all day. DrO |
Member: Stevens |
Posted on Sunday, Jun 4, 2006 - 5:27 pm: I once had a trainer tell me that new horses are more appealing to resident insects. I have no idea if it's true or not, but maybe once your horse settles in he'll either be less attractive to the bugs or get desensitized.My oldest horse has/had very bad reactions to fly bites. The only way I was able to get it under control was fly sheet, mask and wraps for his legs. I couldn't find a product that helped for any length of time. I changed barns to one where there were automatic fly sprayers and he cleared up. Good Luck. |
Member: Djws |
Posted on Monday, Jun 5, 2006 - 12:17 am: Ann,Can you post the recipe? Perhaps it is on this site already and I am just not locating it! Does it dull their coat? THANKS! |
Member: Eoeo |
Posted on Monday, Jun 5, 2006 - 1:14 am: Has anyone had any success with feeding garlic to make the horses less attractive to insects? EO |
Member: Corinne |
Posted on Monday, Jun 5, 2006 - 10:37 am: Little King Ranch...that would interesting to know. As I do worry about the constant application of fly spray on the skin.I can confirm garlic consumption makes me less attractive to my husband....LOL. Corinne |
Member: Annes |
Posted on Monday, Jun 5, 2006 - 11:32 am: DJ - The recipe I use is:1/3 cup white vinegar 1/3 cup Dawn dishwashing liquid (original blue) 1 cup water I triple the amounts and mix in a spray bottle. I hope you have good results. It does have to be sprayed every day and you can reapply more often if needed. I see a huge improvement with my horses - no fly spray I have purchased has worked as well. They also wear fly masks. I have not noticed it dulling their coat. Little King Ranch - I did use the garlic for several years (I purchased from Springtime Inc. catalog)and had good results. Then for whatever reason, one summer it didn't seem to work as well. Since I started using the spray above I haven't tried it again. |
Member: Cpacer |
Posted on Monday, Jun 5, 2006 - 3:25 pm: all the ingredients that happen to be under the kitchen sink -- guess it's worth a shot, at least to spray on my clothes for starters. I have a funny vision of a sudsy horse coming in from the rain!His eye was open the next day and the welts started going down, now mostly scabby areas where he's rubbed the skin off. I recall him having a swollen eye last year but I think it was later. I've started keeping a month by month journal so if things start-up at the same time every year I'll remember (like the swollen glands earlier this spring). Dr.O how long do you think I should give him the Azium? Are there any side effects of it? |
Member: Djws |
Posted on Monday, Jun 5, 2006 - 11:11 pm: Thanks Ann! I am going to give it a whirl. I use Farnam's roll-on repellent, collars and leg bands, Off with deet (oops, I've been using 30%), fly masks, etc. I much prefer the thought of the more "natural" ingredients. I worry about all of the chemicals in the sprays, but I hate to see my buddy stomping and biting to rid himself of flies! He's alone and can't even get aid from the help of an equine friend (i.e., swishing of tails)! This is my first horse and I am so grateful for this site! I don't know what I'd do without the knowledge that Dr. O and all the H/A members share. Thanks to each and every one of you! |
Member: Vickiann |
Posted on Friday, Jun 9, 2006 - 12:18 pm: Dawn detergent makes MY hands peel, so I wouldn't dare to put it on my horse with sensitive skin. Dr. O is right on about the "natural ingredients." For the one horse, the worst thing I can do to him is to apply anything containing citronella (hives, peeling skin) or Avon skin-so-soft. All 3 horses tolerate Farnam's Flysect. I use the Super-C, which is the concentrate, which I mix out with 4 parts of water. It kills ticks and is good against mosquitoes and other biting flies. NOTHING seems to work with some of them! I used garlic a few years ago and it did seem to make my horses a bit less attractive to bugs than horses not on it, but it certainly was no solution to any of our Florida pests. |
Member: Erika |
Posted on Saturday, Jun 10, 2006 - 8:44 am: Just a laugh about "natural"...poison ivy! |