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Michelle Taylor
New Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 1
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 27, 2003 - 5:03 pm: |   |
I have a 10 year old mare that I bred in March to my 2 year old colt, this was the second mare he bred this year, we hand bred them and then turned them out together. They were together from 3/17 to 3/21. She was out when we brought them back. The first mare he bred was checked in foal on 3/29. Had the vet out to check my horse on 4/7 this should have been about 18 days. The vet couldn’t find a foal, said she had a 31 follicle, closed cervix but that I should tease her and she’d probably be ready to breed in a few days. I had her re-checked on 4/11, as she hadn’t come in, kept wanting to kill the stallion. The vet said she had a 45 follicle and it was softening said she would ovulate w/in 20 hours. She still had a closed cervix and wanted nothing to do with the stallion. This vet also did not find a foal. She should have been approximately 21 days then.
He offered to come back in a week and give her a lute shot. I’m not a big fan of hormone manipulation, as I haven't had much success with it in the past, so I declined. I have teased her all this week and nothing but aggressive behavior toward stallion. If she ovulated like he said and I use 4/12 as day 1 (do you use the day of ovulation or the day after as day 1?) then today 4/27 she would be 16 days out. She is still not in heat. Any ideas as to what could be going on? How strange is it for a mare to have a follicle and a closed cervix? I know we are supposed to think that their cycles are regulated by light and no weather but we had a warm winter, 60’s in January and early February. Not much snow until end of February. March and April have been cold and wet. Could that make a difference? She had her transitional cycle from 1/17 to 2/27! We bred her on her second cycle of the year and I didn’t have her checked before we bred. I had her cultured at the end of her transitional cycle, and she was clean. What are the chances that she’s in foal and they missed it twice, 18 and 21 days? Do mares have false pregnancies? Why would she have a follicle and her cervix be closed? I don’t want to think my vet doesn’t know what he’s doing. But this is really making me nuts.
My vet is coming back out on 4/30 for other things. If I have him check her and she’s got a follicle but still not in heat, what should I ask him to look for? Tests to run?
Thanks
Michelle
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Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 8251
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 27, 2003 - 7:16 pm: | |
A mature follicle without other signs of estrus generally indicates either a pregnancy or a retained corpus luteum. I really cannot guess what the chances are that they may have missed a pregnancy but if you are not sure have her checked a third time. I don't think the weather has much to do with this. We have articles on mares not returning to heat (Equine Diseases » Reproductive Diseases » Trouble Settling Mares & Stallion Infertility » Abnormal Heat Cycles) and the use of hormones in mares (Equine Medications and Nutriceuticals » Reproductive Drugs), read them to understand what you should do if you become convinced she is not pregnant.
DrO |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 3
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 27, 2003 - 9:09 pm: | |
Wouldn't they see the CL on the ultra sound? Should I have a hormone essay run to? |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 4
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Apr 27, 2003 - 11:37 pm: | |
One other question, if she has a retained corpus luteum would she still build follicles? If so can she get a leutalyse shot if she has both,durring that cycle? |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 8253
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Monday, Apr 28, 2003 - 5:58 am: | |
Usually CL are visible but much harder to see, remember it is the hormones released b the CL that prevent a mare from returning to heat: if your mare is not returning to heat and is not anestral, she has a CL present. Yes mares can build follicles in the prescense of a CL, just as they can while during diestrus normaly and during the first few months of pregnancy. This will even ovulate sometimes while they remain out of heat.
DrO |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 5
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Monday, Apr 28, 2003 - 10:28 am: | |
Ok so if he finds a follicle, no foal and her cervix is still closed can he give her a shot even though she is supposed to be in heat given the size of the follicle? |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 8262
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Monday, Apr 28, 2003 - 7:35 pm: | |
Michelle, I cannot examine your mare so I cannot make specific recommendations for your horse. From the information you give that would seem to be the next logical step but this is a decision that must be made by your vet.
DrO |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 6
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Monday, Apr 28, 2003 - 8:29 pm: | |
Ok thanks, I was actually just wondering if you can still give the shot if the mare is developing another follicle. Or if it has to be just 6 days after she ovulated. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 8270
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 29, 2003 - 4:53 am: | |
The problem is we are hypothesizing a CL that does not want to regress naturally. I would try the lutalyse, follicle or no follicle. It may not even respond to one injection of Lutalyse, Michelle, I usually give it in cases like this every other 2 to 3 days till she returns to heat.
DrO |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 7
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 29, 2003 - 11:38 am: | |
Thanks again for the info. I gave it to her yesterday so if she doesn't come back in by tomorrow I'll go get another shot and see what happens. Thanks for being there. While the vets here are great no one is really a repro speciallist and they are so busy that unless you sit on them you don't get things done besides it being next to impossible to get past the girls in the front office. They seem to always make me feel like I'm just a pest. Well I digress. I'll let you know how it turns out.
Michelle |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 8276
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 29, 2003 - 9:24 pm: | |
It's what we are here for.
DrO |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 9
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 1, 2003 - 5:15 pm: | |
Well my mare is WAY in heat today so the shot worked. Thanks for the info again. |
Michelle Taylor
Member
Username: Khomagic
Post Number: 11
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 8:56 pm: | |
Just thought I'd update you. Today is day 15 counting from when she would no longer except the stallion. She is not in heat. No guarantee with her as I found out earlier this year. My vet will be out on 5/29 to check her. If she's open she's done for this year. She's going out to pasture for the summer and my stallion is at a training barn so I don't want to try again this year. I'll let you know what we find.
Michelle
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grayce's mom
Member
Username: Debhall
Post Number: 4
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, Jun 1, 2005 - 9:40 am: | |
I have a 22yoquarter horse that has been breed on the foal heat for 4 years.She foaled on 5-11 and was in season 5-21-5-25. She would not settle She tried to "kill" the stallion. The vet thought it would be best if we waited to the next cycle. My question we bought this mare bred and I have no clue as to what her cycle dates may be. I would like to breed her for a foal next year. What course of should I follow given her age? She has always been easy to breed.What happen this time is ?? |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 684
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, Jun 1, 2005 - 10:42 am: | |
I have seen mares that if they have a stud colt instead of a filly at side will be much more protective of the foal. We had a mare that if she had a colt and not a filly would not even show estrus, but would have a "silent heat." She was normal when she had a filly.
Can you follow this mare with ultra sound? That way you will know when she is breedable. |
