Use the navigation bar above to access articles and more discussions on this topic.
| Author |
Message |
    
Ann S
Member
Username: annes
Post Number: 197
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 - 11:40 am: |   |
The vet wants to put my 5 yr old gelding, Buster, on Thyroxin. This is based on his cresty neck and the fact I am having difficulty getting him to lose weight. The vet pulled blood and Buster tested 1.0 (the vet said normal range is 0.5 to 3.0)and thinks even though he is in the low range, I will see a big difference in his weight if I put him on Thyroxin. Buster gets no grain or treats; just grass hay. For the last 6-8 weeks, I have ridden him a lot more and he is out 24/7 on a small field with poor grass grazed very low. He has lost some weight but not enough. He does not have a history of founder. I just read the article and was surprised to find he does not have any of the indicators for hypothyroidism. He has never had a poor appetite or shed late either. He has plenty of energy and a beautiful coat. In addition, my vet did not tell me he would need to be monitored by follow up blood tests while on the Thyroxin. He just said he would need to be on it the rest of his life. I think my next step will be to put Buster in a much smaller lot and give him less hay. I guess I just wanted to be assured by others that this is the thing to do. I was so shocked when I read DrO's article - I was so close to giving Buster Thyroxin...I was going to pick it up today. |
Julie Masner
Member
Username: juliem
Post Number: 189
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 - 1:55 pm: | |
I had a horse that was put on thyroid medication by a previous vet for the same symptoms you describe. My current vet, while he agreed I must continue the use, is totally in agreement with Dr. O and feels certain the horse didn't need it in the first place. A fact he reminded me of every time I went in to the clinic to get another container of it! My horse was insulin resistant and responded very well to a carefully managed diet and exercise. I added magnesium and chromium to his diet as an experiment my vet wanted to try and it seemed to help reduce the crestiness and fat pads. The key is no grass in the spring or fall when cool nights raise the sugar content. Even very short grass will provide more sugar than an insulin resistant horse should have. Actually, short grass has a higher concentration of sugar. That's a vast simplification, but you get the idea. You're right--a dry lot and reduced hay--feed little, feed often. |
Ann S
Member
Username: annes
Post Number: 199
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 - 2:41 pm: | |
Julie, thanks for your comments. I am confused though - why do you need to continue the thyroid medication for your horse if diet/exercise regulates his weight and the vet thinks he doesn't need it? Now I am not sure if my horse is insulin resistant or just overweight. He hasn't always had the cresty neck. I will be very careful with him on the grass just in case. |
Julie Masner
Member
Username: juliem
Post Number: 190
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 - 3:15 pm: | |
It's my understanding that once you start the thyroid supplementation, the horse's own thyroid stops functioning properly. So, once you start using it, you have to continue for the lifetime of the horse. I think they actually can be weaned off, but it requires regular blood tests, etc., that my vet felt were more trouble than just continuing the supplementation. Julie |
Ann S
Member
Username: annes
Post Number: 200
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 - 3:54 pm: | |
Julie, thanks so much for explaining this to me. The more I know about it, the more I don't want to put my horse on the medication. It ticks me off a little bit that my vet didn't tell me any of this. - Ann |
cindy O'DELL
Member
Username: zarr
Post Number: 598
Registered: 6-2000
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 - 8:40 pm: | |
Ann, my mare had trouble 5-6 years back was put on Thryoixn because of the same diagnosis as yours however at no time did my vet say for life nor was she check more than twice a year. She was on the meds for 1 1/2 years and the 1/2 year was more my fear than anything else. She has been fine for a number of years now both diet and weight are watched closely. Cindy |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 18584
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 30, 2007 - 8:17 am: | |
Hello Everyone,
It may surprise you to know that frustration over trying to educate horse owners on the hypothyroid issues in adult horses is one of the main factors that got me started in writing equine health articles. When I started it didn't help that hypothyroidism was a accepted in the veterinary texts and community as a common disorder of horses. I was considered a bit of a nut...
Well 25 years later the discussion has changed for the most part anyway. While it is now generally published and becoming accepted that this is not a problem in adult horses, some are putting forth the idea of inducing a medicated hyperthyroid state to help maintain weight control horses with equine metabolic syndrome horses.
I cannot argue against this in theory. I have known horses that have been on it long term and did not seem to suffer any ills, oddly as over medication of humans has major side effects. In practice I started like everyone else: fat-cresty-founder, let me give you a bottle of thyroxin, all will be well. But this is not what occurred and until I instituted controlled rapidly fermentable carbohydrate environments did I get any success and began studying the evidence for hypothyroidism in horses. Once you realized that resting thyroid values in horses are not indicative of thyroid function, there was none.
So there you have it. I do not recommend it's use and instead suggest you follow the recommendations in the article Diseases of Horses » Endocrine System » Equine Metabolic Syndrome (Peripheral Cushings) which is what Ann S's horse is most likely suffering from.
Concerning weaning off long term thyroxin administration. I don't have any evidence that it cannot be done slowly and the thyroid will come back, Julie. Have you tried it with problems?
I would learn the signs of hypothyroidism then begin lowering the dose by one quarter of the dose you are giving, then every two months till you are down to giving almost none before coming off all together. If you wanted an extra step of care you could check levels before each lowering with the understanding that anything remotely close to normal is probably OK.
DrO |
Cynthia Dittmar, RVT
Member
Username: ryle
Post Number: 89
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 30, 2007 - 10:02 am: | |
Another thing you should consider with this horse since you haven't been seeing significant weight loss with the dietary changes you have already made would be to soak your hay for 30 minutes prior to feeding. If your horse is Insulin Resistant and suffers from EMS, then reducing the non-structural carb content of your hay is also important to effectively manage the problem. |
Ann S
Member
Username: annes
Post Number: 201
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 30, 2007 - 1:17 pm: | |
DrO - Thanks for your clear explanation. I read the article on EMS and it does fit Buster. The thing that really jumped out at me was the swollen sheath. I have noticed for a long time how much larger his sheath is than my other two geldings. I kept checking for a bean thinking he had an infection but never found anything. I feel better now that I know what I am dealing with and have a plan. Thanks everyone for your experiences. And, Cynthia, it is good to know about soaking the hay. I am anxious to get Buster back to a good weight. I am happy that I caught this before he had any lameness issues. I rode him again last night and plan to continue daily even if I have to miss riding the others for now. |
Julie Masner
Member
Username: juliem
Post Number: 192
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 30, 2007 - 5:55 pm: | |
Dr. O, we didn't try weaning him off. He was started on in in 1998 and when I asked about getting him off, my vet felt it was just simpler to continue as the supplement was inexpensive and he was on a minimal dose. He foundered in '98 and that's why the previous vet started him on it, although he was overweight, energetic and healthy! Management, especially trimming and, initially natural balance shoeing, kept him sound. Later he was sound barefoot on any surface and was a joy to rides. Sadly, I lost him to a tortion colic the end of March. |
Julie Masner
Member
Username: juliem
Post Number: 193
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 30, 2007 - 5:57 pm: | |
Dr. O, we didn't try weaning him off. He was started on it in 1998 and when I asked about getting him off, my vet felt it was just simpler to continue as the supplement was inexpensive and he was on a minimal dose. He foundered in '98 and that's why the previous vet started him on it, although he was overweight, energetic and healthy! Management, especially trimming and, initially natural balance shoeing, kept him sound. Later he was sound barefoot on any surface and was a joy to ride. Sadly, I lost him to a tortion colic the end of March. |
Erika L
Member
Username: erika
Post Number: 859
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 11:34 am: | |
I am so glad to have Dr. O around as the voice of reason!
I too, years ago was prescribed thyroid for my mare who had foundered. Seemed to do nothing for her. After much research, I decided to taper off. No problem.
The thing that has worked for her is exercise and lower calories. She gets grass hay in winter, limited grazing in summer, and as much exercise as I can manage to give her. This means lots of trotting and cantering, not strolling through the woods...
She has not had a founder episode in years now. |
Ann S
Member
Username: annes
Post Number: 208
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, Jun 28, 2007 - 2:25 pm: | |
Update...Buster has lost 73 lbs in 4 weeks! (he started at 1,111 lbs.) I soaked his hay at first but after a week remembered I still had some good 1 yr. old hay and have been giving him that 2x a day (no grain/treats). He is in a 20'x20' stall which opens into a 60'X200' lot with minimal grass. I have ridden him every day for 30-40 min (except 4 days when it rained) and longer on weekends. Since my non-horsey husband doesn't appreciate this milestone, I thought I would post here where others understand. I think he could lose about 40 more lbs. As a rule of thumb, can anyone tell me if this is a normal weight loss over that period of time? I am giving him the Vit E and Multiple Vitamin supplements and he looks and feels great. I know he misses running & playing with the others and hope I can maintain him at a good weight when the time comes to turn him out with his buddies. |
Diane Edmonds
Member
Username: scooter
Post Number: 1055
Registered: 9-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Jun 28, 2007 - 8:16 pm: | |
Congratulations Ann, that is great keep up the good work. I know mine seem to plateau after their initial significant weight loss, that only exercise seems to get rid of. Good luck |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 18762
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Friday, Jun 29, 2007 - 10:05 am: | |
Sounds good to me Ann S.
DrO |
Ann S
Member
Username: annes
Post Number: 209
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Friday, Jun 29, 2007 - 11:57 am: | |
Thanks Diane & DrO for the encouraging words. It was certainly worth the extra time and work to see him lose the weight...by the way, I lost more weight in the first week than Buster did! |
