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KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 726
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 - 12:33 pm: |   |
About 2-3 weeks ago we noticed that Yogi was acting depressed, and had a little weight loss, but he could lose a little weight and not really miss it. It stayed that way until about a week ago and he started going downhill fast. He has muscle wasting (confirmed with blood test - don't know what test, and visually very apparent), and severe weight loss and temp 102 and swollen hocks. One week ago he had lost 100 lbs in a month (we know because he was weighed at the vet's office.) The vet saw him last week and was very disturbed, thought ulcers, maybe ??? Also temp was 102. Put him on U-Guard and drew blood. NSF except test that showed muscle wasting and low white blood cell count. We increased his grain but he kept losing weight (another 10 lbs in 5 days). He is very depressed, appetite OK but not great. His hocks started swelling on Saturday. He is at the vet hospital and getting IV tetracycline - vet thinking Lyme, but not sure. But he is in such bad shape he didn't want to wait for test to come back. Drew blood again and everything ok except white blood cell again (don't have report so don't have numbers yet). Will have to wait for Lyme titer test. He will consult with Texas A&M if Yogi doesn't improve in the next day or so.
Have read articles in different sections because his symptoms are covered in a few sections, not just fever.
Do these symptoms ring a bell with anyone? DrO? We are very worried about him since he has deteriorated so quickly.
Thanks, Kathleen |
Holly Wood
Member
Username: hwood
Post Number: 2143
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 - 1:07 pm: | |
Kathleen, so sorry to hear about Yogi. What a cutie he is . . . such a loveable guy. Glad he is at the vet's where he can get instant care.
Waiting anxiously to hear more about his diagnosis and treatment. |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 727
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 - 2:48 pm: | |
I made a mistake in my original post - his white cell count was increased, not low.
Holly, yes we're glad the vet decided to keep him there. I feel he's getting the best care possible.
Kathleen |
Shawna
Member
Username: qh4me
Post Number: 350
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 - 4:02 pm: | |
Kathleen,
Sending many healing thoughts Yogi's way. I hope they get him feeling better and he is back home with you soon, happy and healthy! |
cindy O'DELL
Member
Username: zarr
Post Number: 718
Registered: 6-2000
| | Posted on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 - 7:21 pm: | |
Kathleen, by now you know I feel in love with Yogi a long time back ! If wishes and prayers could heal in an instant Yogi would be fine, NOW, but will pray all the more til he is well again! This is the prayer I sent to Libby ...
The sage is burnt...it's prayer do heed... to heal with strength for those in need...we join our hearts.. our souls, our hopes for heavens strength and love to cope .... Cindy |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 19054
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 - 7:28 pm: | |
Depression, weight loss and muscle wasting, low grade fever, elevated WBC count, bilateral swelling in the hocks. Certainly first impressions are inflammatory disorders and possibly some toxins right now it is hard to say more than that. Could you list the tests that were done including the normals, the results including the units, and the normals for your lab? How about respiration and heart rate? Gum color? Capillary refill time? Exposure to anything unusual?
DrO |
Aileen
Member
Username: sunny66
Post Number: 1941
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 3:50 pm: | |
Sending positive healing thoughts to Yogi and strength to you, Kathleen! |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 729
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 5:43 pm: | |
DrO,
These are the tests run:
Test-----------Results-------Ref Range---Units
AST (SGOT)-----163 (low)-----180-570-----IU/L
Tot Bilirubin--2.6 (high)----0.1-2.5-----mg/dL
Alk Phosphatase--409 (high)--50-300------IU/L
GGT------------11------------2-30--------IU/L
Tot Protein----6.4-----------5.6-8.0-----g/dL
Albumin--------2.5-----------2.2-3.9-----g/dL
Globulin-------3.9-----------2.6-5.6-----g/dL
A/G RAtio------0.6-----------.05-2.4---------
Cholesterol-----52(low)-------70-150------mg/dL
BUN------------12------------10-25-------mg/dL
Creatinine-----1.0 (low)-----1.2-2.0-----mg/dL
BUN/Creat Ratio--12----------5-21-------------
Phosphorus-----2.3-----------2.0-5.6-----mg/dL
Calcium--------11.7----------10.0-13.7---mg/dL
Glucose--------52 (low)------70-120------mg/dL
Sodium---------135-----------130-146-----mEq/L
Potassium------4.0-----------3-5---------mEq/L
Na/K Ratio-----34------------24-58-------
Chloride-------97------------95-110------mEq/L
CPK------------34------------20-500------IU/L
LDH------------299-----------150-450-----IU/L
WBC------------13.0 (high)---5.5-12.5---10to3rd/uL
RBC------------7.7-----------6.5-10.5---10to6th/uL
HGB-----------12.7-----------11.0-19.0---g/dL
HCT------------37------------35-52-------%
MCV------------48------------34-58-------fL
MCH------------16.6----------12.3-19.7---pg
MCHC-----------34------------31-37-------%
Comment
RBC morphology normal
DIFFERENTIAL---ABSOLUTE---%
Neutrophils---11960 (high)-92--2700-6700--/uL
Lymphocytes---910 (low)-----7--1500-5500--/uL
Monocytes-----130-----------1-----0-800---/uL
Eosinophils-----0-----------0-----0-800---/uL
Basophils-------0-----------0-----0-170---/uL
Platelet Estimate Adequate
Cap refill time - normal
Gum color - good
Resp and heart rate - ??
Thanks
Kathleen |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: mrose
Post Number: 3093
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 5:49 pm: | |
Kathleen, I was so hoping Yogi would be feeling better by now. I'll keep those good thoughts going for both of you. |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 730
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 5:50 pm: | |
I missed a test -
Fibrinogen (Semi-Quantitative)
Fibrinogen, Semi-Quant---100---100-400 mg/dl |
Tonya Bauer
Member
Username: pbauer
Post Number: 287
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 6:13 pm: | |
Kathleen,
I'm very sorry to hear about "our" Yogi! He is such a wonderful boy...he gets that from his mother 
I don't know if I ever told you,(before I knew much about you)...I was looking at your profile, and fell in love with the picture you have posted of Yogi and Mona. In fact, I put it in my favorite pictures file!
All of you are in my thoughts and prayers...Annie, too.
Love,
Tonya |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 731
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 9:29 pm: | |
Thanks everyone. The vet has changed the antibiotic to Doxycycline in pill form so Yogi is coming home tomorrow. He was getting antibiotic IV thus staying at the hospital. He still looks like we have starved him and his appetite is just so so. His temp is down to normal and he seemed just a bit brighter today. We're hoping that the antibiotic will bring him around. It is supposed to work better on internal abscesses in case that is what is going on, but will still help with Lyme if that is the case. Still don't really know what is wrong with him. Wish him luck. DrO, any more ideas? How can he have swollen joints and low normal fibrinogen results?
Kathleen |
Ann
Member
Username: dres
Post Number: 1412
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 9:37 pm: | |
 On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.. |
Angie J.
Member
Username: ajudson1
Post Number: 1332
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 - 10:15 pm: | |
Sending healing thoughts and prayers for Yogi. Take care of yourself too. |
Fran C
Member
Username: canter
Post Number: 1137
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 - 7:58 am: | |
Wishing you and Yogi all the best, Kathleen. I hope you find answers and that he'll soon be home, healthy and happy. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 19064
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 - 8:20 am: | |
Kathleen you write out all that lab work but leave out the two most important pieces of information, maybe the only really important pieces of information: your horses respiration and heart rate. These need to be documented and kept track of as long as disease is ongoing.
I don't see any obvious problems in the above blood work other than the evaluation that this appears to be an inflammatory disorder because of the high neutrophils, low lymphocytes.
The low glucose is most often an artifact of the blood being stored for a period before submitted to the lab, a common and sometimes unavoidable problem with field work. The fibrinogen level is very time sensitive in all the tests I am aware of. I wonder about the accuracy of these two results and the fibrinogen level can help differentiate chronic inflammatory disorders from acute. It should be noted that clinical signs from Lymes disease is not a established entitiy and so far experiments have found that while horses contract and shed the organism, no one has been able to produce clinical disease, other than possibly a mild fever in immune crippled subjects, in a horse by infecting them in the laboratory using infected ticks.
DrO |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 732
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 - 9:31 am: | |
We are picking Yogi up this morning and I will ask the vet what Yogi's resp and heart rate have been. We understand about Lyme but I think that Yogi looked so bad that he decided to try antibiotic rather than wait for results that might or might not tell us anything. He thought maybe Lyme because of all the deer living on the property and a little wishful thinking. That's my take on the situation. He also mentioned internal abscess and he talked to a doc at Texas A&M and he mentioned some things. Can't remember everything because we talked about so many things that I would need a tape recorder or a secretary to remember it all. Tumor was discussed as well as other things. A trip to A&M and possibly spending the national debt and also that it is possible that we may find something that we cannot do anything about, was discussed also. Will update you and resp and heart rate ASAP.
Kathleen |
LL
Member
Username: frances
Post Number: 503
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 - 10:37 am: | |
I wish you and Yogi all the very best Kathleen. I'm sure he'll be happy to be home - it must be a fairly good sign that the vet is releasing him and doesn't feel he needs to be under observation? Positive thoughts coming your way. |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 733
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 - 2:58 pm: | |
DrO
resp when admitted on Monday were 35, heart rate normal. Both have remained normal since the second day.
The blood tests above were from 8/21.
The first tests were run 8/16. The differences of note were (and I realize that some may not be significant):
8/16 - Neutrophils - 8787
8/21 - Neutrophils - 11960
8/16 - Lymphocytes - 909
8/21 - Lymphocytes - 910
8/16 - Monocytes - 202
8/21 - Monocytes - 130
8/16 - Fibrinogen - 200
8/21 - Fibrinogen - 100
8/16 - WBC - 10.1
8/21 - WBC - 13.0
All other values were pretty much the same.
Temp has ranged between 102.2 to 99.6. Today was 100.0.
Was on 1 gm bute on Monday and Tuesday.
Also something not noted above was that he also had swollen front fetlocks when admitted on Monday. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 19066
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Friday, Aug 24, 2007 - 6:46 am: | |
The elevated respiratory rate seems to mirror the fever as it often does. The now normal vital signs and the relatively normal lab findings on the organ tests don't suggest serious disease and perhaps this was just a transient infection. I have my fingers crossed but the weight loss remains worrisome...has anyone done a thoracocentesis for a sample of peritoneal fluid? It is a simple procedure that can yield evidence for abdominal abscesses, abdominal cancer, and a condition known as chronic active peritonitis that may present as above though usually I would expect more change on the hemogram. For chronic inflammatory disease blood fibrinogen remains one the better indicators but this test should be performed within 30 minutes of taking the sample, was this done while at the hospital?
You can read more about 2 types of internal abscessing diseases in the articles on Bastard Strangles and Pigeon Fever. There is more on diagnosing weight loss in the article Diseases of Horses » Colic, Diarrhea, GI Tract » Weight Loss in Horses » Overview of Chronic Weight Loss.
DrO |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 734
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Friday, Aug 24, 2007 - 7:40 pm: | |
The thoracocentesis has not been done to my knowledge. I will ask my vet about it. The blood tests were sent off to be done and we had results the next day, so don't know how long before they were at the lab. The vet who did the last surgery on Yogi's eye does their own bloodwork and I can take him there if it is important to get the fibrinogen test done. I will read the articles, and thank you for your input. Yogi is eating a little better and looks like he is feeling a little better. Not the old Yogi yet though, he still doesn't feel good and his joints are still swollen. Should he be on bute or something else for the joint swelling?
And now to top this whole thing off, Yogi did something to his good eye overnight and is holding it shut and there is some white gunk in the outside corner of the eye. Can see a spot on his lower eyelid that looks like a scrape, so hope that is all it is. Can't see anything wrong with the eye itself, but I am not an expert at looking at eyes. If it's not better in a couple of days, back to the vet he goes. |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 735
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 10:02 am: | |
Update.
This morning Yogi is running a fever of 104.4, resp 44, HR 60. Vet said give in 1 gm bute and call him again in 3 hours. He did say that this isn't good, which I figured out all by my little self (just my attempt at humor). Have to try to keep things in perspective and not worry so much and just get things done (that's a note to myself). |
Diane E.
Member
Username: scooter
Post Number: 1274
Registered: 9-2000
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 10:06 am: | |
Kathleen sorry to hear that. I hope Yogi feels better soon and it is nothing serious. |
Holly Wood
Member
Username: hwood
Post Number: 2169
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 10:55 am: | |
Just saw your post, Kathleen, and I want you to know that I am waiting on pins and needles with you. If it's something toxic in his system, I hope the vet can figure it out and give him just the right medication. He must feel awful . . . and I know you do, too. I have a knot in my stomach all day when my guys are ill . . . and I can feel a knot in my stomach thinking about Yogi. |
Nicole Gossage
Member
Username: ngossage
Post Number: 59
Registered: 1-2007
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 11:05 am: | |
Kathleen, sending positive thoughts your & Yogi's way. Hang in there. Hope to hear good news soon.
Nicole |
cindy O'DELL
Member
Username: zarr
Post Number: 723
Registered: 6-2000
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 11:42 am: | |
Yogi, your mom is very worried about you so you need to help her! You need to be strong and brave and fight this trouble with all that you have .So many of us here are trying to help with all the strength and love we can send, get well fast Yogi so your mom doesn't have to worry anymore! Love Cindy |
Suzanne Moore
Member
Username: suzym
Post Number: 447
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 11:49 am: | |
I'm holding my breath. I've been where you are, so I know only too well what you're going through. The waiting is almost unbearable.
I will be thinking about you and Yogi.
Suzy |
Lilo
Member
Username: lilo
Post Number: 573
Registered: 4-2000
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 1:42 pm: | |
Sending positive and hopefully healing thoughts to Yogi. Hoping he will fight it off - with your help and the vet's help.
Lilo |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 736
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 2:15 pm: | |
Thanks everyone,
Yogi's temp is down to 102 and I am to take it tonight to make sure it has not spiked again. If is has I am to give him bute again. His hocks are getting more swollen and look painful (don't really know if they are). The vet mentioned that he may have a tumor and that finding it may be a bit of a problem. Let's hope he can just fight his way through this, he has always been so strong. Luckily he still has an appetite and is eating almost all of what we give him.
Thanks again
Kathleen |
Holly Wood
Member
Username: hwood
Post Number: 2172
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 2:59 pm: | |
Kathleen, does the vet think that ice boots might help? If you can get his circulation moving in his lets . . .
Wish you could lay him on his back with his feet up to let them drain . . . |
Shirley Johnson
Member
Username: shirl
Post Number: 526
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 3:01 pm: | |
Kathleen,
Sending healing thoughts and prayers your way. Will light a candle for you and Yogi.
Shirl |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 737
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 3:12 pm: | |
Holly, the vet hasn't mentioned them, I will ask when I talk to him again. That's quite a site with Yogi on his back with his legs in the air!! |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: mrose
Post Number: 3103
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Saturday, Aug 25, 2007 - 7:03 pm: | |
Kathleen, are his lower legs swollen entirely, or his fetlocks and hocks, or just his hocks? I'm sure you've read on this site everything about swellings. I know the horse we had that had a reaction to hoary allisium (at least that was the best diagnosis the vet and we could come up with) got swollen legs. Also, horses with pupura hemographica (sp?) get swollen legs and a fever. Just, like you, am really wondering what is going on with him. People get a type of arthritis that will cause swellings, fever and pain in the joints and muscles. I would think such an inflamation would show in a blood test though.
Good luck with him. Tell Yogi he has a lot of fans out here that just think he's the cutest thing going and he'd better shape up and get better! |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 19072
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 8:43 am: | |
Kathleen what is the characteristics of this joint swelling? Is it firm or soft and fluid like? Is it around the joints or the joint capsule itself that is swollen?
DrO |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 738
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 9:00 am: | |
DrO
The vet said the swelling is in the joint capsule. It is fairly soft, but does not pit. He had a fever of 103.4 last night and I gave him bute. Going out now to check his temp. My husband fed him this morning and said he was showing no interest in his grain.
Kathleen |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 739
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 9:26 am: | |
His temp is normal, but he has swelling on the left side of his face from his eye socket, the one that was enucleated, down to centerline of the jaw underneath and from cheekbone to throatlatch. Doesn't seem painful but he won't open his mouth. He is hungry and goes from one pile of hay to another but hasn't taken a bite. Vet will be back in town at 2:00 and I am to take Yogi to the clinic at that time. He mentioned that we may be getting to the bottom of this, but didn't expound on it. Will know more later. |
Suzanne Moore
Member
Username: suzym
Post Number: 448
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 11:19 am: | |
I sure hope you get some answers, Kathleen. I'll keep my fingers crossed.
Suzy |
Chris Doyle
Member
Username: christel
Post Number: 307
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 11:52 am: | |
Kathleen, I too hope you get an answer this afternoon. Wonder if your vet is thinking- strangles?- my first thoughts since he is now swelling in the jaw area. Very curable, I hope it is something along those lines.
Positive thoughts- headed your way.
Chris |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 740
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 1:02 pm: | |
Chris,
I was thinking about strangles also. That would be a blessing at this point. I wonder if swollen joints goes along with strangles. Also where would he have picked it up. The only time he is off the property is to go to the vet. Wish him luck.
Kathleen |
Vicki Zaneis
Member
Username: vickiann
Post Number: 490
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 2:59 pm: | |
Hope things get better soon, Kathleen. |
KATHLEEN WHEAT
Member
Username: kathleen
Post Number: 741
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 6:28 pm: | |
Not good news. We took Yogi to the vet today and he will stay there and get steroids and baytril as a last ditch effort. Vet pretty sure it is autoimmune disorder. It is attacking his good eye now. He said he doesn't feel good about the outcome.
Kathleen |
cindy O'DELL
Member
Username: zarr
Post Number: 726
Registered: 6-2000
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 6:49 pm: | |
Beyond sorrow , but still praying so very hard! Cindy |
Aileen
Member
Username: sunny66
Post Number: 1944
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, Aug 26, 2007 - 7:05 pm: | |
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