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Mishelle A. Carrick
New Member
Username: Spencer6
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Friday, Nov 12, 2004 - 2:26 pm: |   |
Dr. O and all,
I am writing this as a follow up to my postings of last Spring 2003. My horse was exhibiting gut pain but was never off his grain and never showed any signs of impaction. He had 4 episodes where vet was called, Banamine & oil administered, horse seemed better -- Banamine the key here. Horse would be ok for day or two then act collicky again. I also treated him for ulcers (Gastro Gard by mfr. directions) and treated him with Praziquantil (Equimax/Iver Gold), limited his grass intake in case it was gas...so it is difficult to know which did the trick (if any). Symptoms dissapeared until Spring 2004. This past Spring he started exhibiting mild signs of same type of colic (camping out, slight pawing) very mild. I tested him for Tapes (proper test is a'sugar test' according to my vet) test came back positive, I wormed w/Equimax, symptoms dissapeared IMMEDIATELY. While I know we can almost never be sure, this recent episode seems to indicate Tapeworms may have been the culprit in my horses current and previous mild colics. My horse is wormed every 6-7 weeks and has had Praziquantil yearly so it was not a matter of my worming schedule. He is kept on relatively small pasture w/one pasture mate making parasites mgmt a bit of a struggle. The ulcer theory was a stretch given he was never unwilling to eat and his symptoms did not come after a meal. I want to share this information in the hopes it could help someone facing the same undetermined, mild colics. Parasite infestation is easy to check and may help prevent giving unecessary treatments. It's a good place to start if you are not in an emergency situation. Dr. O and this site were so great to have during that stressful time. I thought a lesson learned would be a good thing to post. |
Christine Holmes Bukowski
Member
Username: Canyon28
Post Number: 89
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Friday, Nov 12, 2004 - 6:24 pm: | |
I agree with you. I also had several mares that exhibited signs of colic which would be resolved for a few days to a few weeks with tubing and banamine. then it would happen again. I finally got the equimax and gave that to a mare last summer and since then she has never had a problem, I did worm her again this summer with the same wormer. I had another older mare i have had for several years that started doing the same thing. After spending some 400 on two vet call outs in a month I wormed her with the ten dollar tube of equimax and she has been fine now for two months. I think tape worms cause many more colics that previously thought, and they cannot be determined through a fecal exam. I wormed my old stallion who had been very gassy and it has taken care of that problem totally. He also looks a lot better and feels better. I had used regular ivermectrin on all of these horses and feel that it was the tapeworms that caused the problem, wich cannot be killed by straight ivermectrin alone. I am now going to worm every horse I own at least once per year with the equimax or ivermectrin gold. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 11496
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Sunday, Nov 14, 2004 - 9:01 am: | |
In horses not treated regularly for them it is believed they may be responsible for 20% of the medical colics and even some surgical diseases. It was just 5 years ago I was telling folks to worm for them just once a year and not worry to much about them.
DrO |
Little King Ranch
Member
Username: Eoeo
Post Number: 94
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, Nov 14, 2004 - 9:31 am: | |
Dr. O, I have a mare who has had periodic episodes of colic prior to when we got her. Since we have had her, she has had 4 mild and then one big whopper when she was 1 month away from foaling this spring. Scared us to death. She foaled without incident but had a small bleeder which we had her packed for a few hours and it seemed to take care of the seeping blood. We did not breed her back of course. I believe I will treat her with the equimax or ivermectin gold. Would you recommend a follow up dose about a month later? In fact, I am going to go through all 30+ head. I would imagine the weanlings would have picked them up if they are present. Thank you for all your advice and all the others who post here. Excellent website. EO |
Christine Holmes Bukowski
Member
Username: Canyon28
Post Number: 90
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Nov 14, 2004 - 10:14 am: | |
I would try the equimax which is approved for foaling mares and breeding stallions now. It wasnt approved last year, but I took the chance anyway to worm the mare I had that was acting colicy every few days, because I knew I would lose her if I didnt do something! She came through it fine, although she was only a couple of months pg when I had to worm her and her nursing foal with the equimax. I had to send away for it through valley vet or jeffers, because I could not get it here in town. My vet suggested it also ,when a cause could not be determined for her colicy episodes.
Use the wormer and then go from there. It may clear up all her problems or it may be something else but at least you will know it isnt tapeworms.I dont know the life cycle of tape worms, maybe a follow up dose would be in order to get ones that were encysted or hatched after the initial dose? Dr O should know the answer to that question. |
Christine Holmes Bukowski
Member
Username: Canyon28
Post Number: 91
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, Nov 14, 2004 - 10:21 am: | |
I wanted to add that both of my mares were off feed, picking at feed when normally they were almost pawing at the gate to get their hay every day. they would go lay down while hay was present, really a bad sign. They did some rolling but not much. Them being off their feed was the best sign that I saw that something was wrong. I dont wait until they are rolling and thrashing, have never let a colic get that far. I am here most of the day every day and keep a close watch on my mares, which I can see from my office window. At first I did think that the one older mare was aborting, but it didnt happen, so I knew that something else was causing her pain. an aborting mare will have most of the same symptoms of colic, have actually had two vets treat one of my mares for colic when the mare was aborting instead. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 11516
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, Nov 16, 2004 - 8:23 am: | |
Hello Christine,
There is no encysted stage as we see in the strongyles but the sensitivity of the immature forms of the worm have not been studied that I can find. A immediate follow-up dose should not be needed for tapeworms if dewormed properly the first time. The goal of deworming would be to over time rid the the pastures of parasites which is what our deworming programs are designed to do. For more on the life cycle see, Equine Diseases » Colic and GI Diseases » Parasites and Worms » Tapeworms, Cestode spp.
DrO |
Mishelle A. Carrick
Member
Username: Spencer6
Post Number: 2
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, Jan 10, 2005 - 9:01 pm: | |
Wanted to add that I believe I can now tell when my horse is 'wormy'. He seems to have the same symptoms when positive for Tapes (slight camping out and some mild pawing.) He started this again in December, I had a fecal run and he was positive for tapes. I wormed again with Prazi Dec 31(last time was Sept 1) and now I built a barn and moved my horse home with one other pasture mate whose worming I control. Plus, there has never been horses on my farm and I am picking the paddock (2 acre) religiously. And despite lack of clear scientific proof, I have also resorted to using a Diatomaceous Earth natural daily wormer. I have many friends who swear it works and they have fecal tests that prove it. Not sure if my horse is particularly 'wormy' or just sensitive and displays symptoms when most horses would be more stoic? -- Dr. O, what do you think about the DE natural daily wormer? I use the ABC Plus NOMS product. Will do another fecal in a month or so but curious about your opinion. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 11818
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, Jan 11, 2005 - 6:30 am: | |
There is no work that I can find on the efficacy or toxicity of DE in horses but I have seen several herds that were wormy while the owners were using DE. I do not know which product or how much. I do not see an indication for its use if you continue to deworm your horses well now that you are in a clean environment.
DrO |
DanaD
Member
Username: Danad
Post Number: 2
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, Jan 12, 2005 - 2:45 pm: | |
Dear Dr.O:
I just read comments about Tapeworm. I too worm my horse (every January) for Tape. I know the new products are out - Zemectrin Gold and Equimax, but I have 2 tubes of Strongid left. I have always used this method before the new ones came out. Should I use the Strongid or better to go and buy Equimax? Thanks. |
Holly Zukowski
Member
Username: Cowgrl
Post Number: 395
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, Jan 12, 2005 - 3:11 pm: | |
I have a question also on tapes but first some background: A woman I know adopted a mustang out of Burns, OR back in October of 2004. About a month afterwards the horse colicked severely and had to be put down 3 days later. Unfortunately, the horse hadn't been gentled sufficiently for the vet to provide much assistance. At first I and a friend thought the horse had colicked from being fed too much grain before the horse's system was accustomed to it.
Turns out, the woman said the vet thinks it was from tapeworm infestation. These mustangs spend a month at the holding facility before being put up for adoption during which time they are wormed, vaccinated, and given any needed vet care as well as hoof care.
Here's the question. Do you know if mustangs out in the wild are prone to contracting tapeworms? The mustangs move around a lot and don't live in one contaminated area if they can help it. If the horse contracted tapeworm at the holding facility, do you think in a month and a half, the tapes would have become so enmassed as to cause fatal colic? Okay, that's two questions.
Thanks. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 11828
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Jan 13, 2005 - 6:50 am: | |
Dana: I would use the strongid up.
Holly: I am not sure of the incidence of tapes in Mustangs and no it seems unlikely that a month and a half exposure would create such a situation.
DrO
Note: learn to post new topic discussions (new is when it does not refer to the dicussions originators subject) in a new discussion. It keeps the discussions easier to find and you will get more answers. |
