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Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 6
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 11:16 pm: |   |
Hello all,
I have a 24 year old Appy gelding who has been acting a bit under the weather for the last few days. He colics once in a while so I listened for gut sounds and heard them on the right, but nothing on the left. He was up on his feet and walking but he holds his head low and has no energy. Today I saw him urinate and it was yellow with a red hue... as his finished the last bit it was pure red then a stream of clotted red blood. I scooped up a sample to take into the vet in the morning but wonder what you folks thought.
Thanks for all your help...
Nance |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12793
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Monday, May 9, 2005 - 6:28 am: | |
Does he have fever Nancy? The next step would be a complete examination including ultrasound and lab work up. Bladder stones or urinary tract infection are most likely but there are other possibilities.
DrO |
Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 8
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Monday, May 9, 2005 - 11:03 am: | |
He does feel overly hot, but I don't have means of taking his temperature. I dropped off a collection of urine to the vet this morning and sit here eagerly awaiting news.... When they call with the results I'll see if the vet will come out and check on him. I adore this horse so I am hoping it is nothing serious...
Thanks for the followup Dr. O... your presence here is very appreciated by us all.
Nance |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12800
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Monday, May 9, 2005 - 6:44 pm: | |
You can use a human thermometer but better would be next trip to the vet ask to buy a large animal thermometer. For proper use and normals see, Equine Diseases » First Aid » Taking Temperature, Pulse, and Respiration. No matter what they fine until they rule out stones with an ultrasound they cannot be sure of the primary disease process. Infections are often secondary to stones.
DrO |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 641
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Monday, May 9, 2005 - 7:12 pm: | |
Most feed and tack shops carry them, too, and they are available through almost all the tack/supply catalogues. They run around $5 to $7 if I remember right. They have digital ones now that are very easy to use, but run a little more. |
Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 9
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 10:49 am: | |
Good news... well... not so good, but an answer none the less. I remembered yesterday that Jake had gotten into the chicken feed over the weekend. I did some research and realized that is where the symptoms are coming from. His appitite seems to slowly be returning as are gut sounds. He isn't out of the woods yet, but with a new mineral salt lick and lots of water along with oil in his feed we may be able to pull out of this yet...
Have any of you had your horse get into the chicken feed? If so, is there something else I should be doing?
Nance |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12813
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 11, 2005 - 6:30 am: | |
Nancy, can you tell us what type chicken feed it was and what was in it that might cause bloody urine? |
Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 10
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 12, 2005 - 1:10 am: | |
It was chicken starter - medicated crumble. I read an article by a vet that explained how someone fed a horse the same feed because they were out of horse feed and in a snow storm. This vet came out the next day and the horse had all the signs of colic and strained to urninate. When the gelding was able to urninate - it was bloody.
Jake got into the crumble on Saturday and by Sunday evening his urnine was yellow / red and kept getting darker until the last little bit was clotted blood. Sunday and Monday he had no interest in food at all. On Tuesday I got him to eat a bit of C.O.B. and a carrot. He nibbles on hay and will eat a carrot or two a few times a day. I haven't seen him drink and his tub seems to be at roughly the same level for several days. I topped it off tonight so I can check on it again in the morning. I had the chicken crumble in a cat litter bucket. It was about a third full - roughly 6 lbs. of feed... While I was at work Jake managed to get the lid off and munched quite a bit of the feed.
The medicated crumble has antibotic and monensin for controlling coccidia.
A link for the article is below... this is how I determined it was the chicken feed.
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/horsehealth/hhview.asp?recno=30183
Any suggestions?
Nance |
Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 11
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 12, 2005 - 1:12 am: | |
Actually it was Amporium... .0125%
He ate about 6 lbs of Purina Start & Grow Sunfresh MP 0.0125% Chicken starter - crumbles. |
Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 12
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 12, 2005 - 1:22 am: | |
http://www.neosoft.com/~iaep/pages/nutrition/toxicosis/monensin.html
Dr. O - take a look at this sight too. I have feed with both substances in it and he did get into both feeds...
Nance |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12825
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, May 12, 2005 - 6:53 am: | |
Wow Nancy, monensin is very toxic to horses and those that survive often have permanant heart damage. That may have not been blood you saw in the urine but myoglobin from the broken down muscle. We have an article on monensin poisoning, and other ionophore growth promoters, that talks about this type poisoning in horses. See Equine Diseases » Nervous System » Dementia: Depression, Excitement, Coma » Livestock Growth Promoters Poisoning.
DrO |
Nance J. Sparks
Member
Username: Njsparks
Post Number: 13
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 12, 2005 - 11:32 am: | |
I'll take a look, thanks Dr. O. I wish there was more information out there about the toxicity of various livestock feeds to horses. Had I known how dangerous it was - I would have secured it far better than I did. It is now locked up in the shed so none of my other horses get a chance to gorge on this stuff... As of this morning he is still standing, eating a bit more and still not drinking much...
In your opinion Dr. O.... should I have him put down?
Nance |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 12831
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, May 12, 2005 - 5:51 pm: | |
All the monensin poisonings I have seen were found dead. I have had several lasalocid (similar but less toxic) poisonings that looked quite bad then recovered after 6 months. You have two hurdles, with myoglobin in the urine there will be kidney damage (maybe that was blood from the myoglobin damage) but intensive fluid therapy may bring him through that. The other and more likely hurdle is the damage to the heart, the only way to assess this would be a complete heart work up. I believe you treat as agressive as your goals allow and give him the best chance you can. You have time to make the last decision but how much is hard to say.
DrO |
