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Patricia Snyder
Member
Username: snyderpm
Post Number: 6
Registered: 2-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, Nov 12, 2008 - 9:31 pm: |   |
Dr. O,
Do you think that Pergolide could increase the risk of allergies by over stimulation of the immune system? |
Lee
Member
Username: paul303
Post Number: 1206
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, Nov 13, 2008 - 1:45 am: | |
Wow, Patricia, why do you ask?? Last August, my 28 yr. old QH mare, on Pergolide for 3 years, had a mild bout of colic ( rare ). I gave her Banamine Paste, and when the vet got there, she tubed her with mineral oil. When I went out late at night, to check her, she was covered in hives.
She'd had Banamine a few times before ( injectable ), but that was before she went on Pergolide. Now, I'M curious. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 21721
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Nov 13, 2008 - 8:34 am: | |
Pergolide, an ergoline-based dopamine receptor agonistis, is not an immune stimulant. It works by decreasing the secretion of abnormal chemicals. These chemicals are responsible for suppressing the immune system, so the pergolide allows the immune system to return to a more normal function. For more on this check out the article on Cushings.
DrO |
Patricia Snyder
Member
Username: snyderpm
Post Number: 7
Registered: 2-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, Nov 13, 2008 - 11:28 am: | |
Dr. O,
I have read everything I can find about Pergolide and Cushings in horses and people. I realize that Pergolide is not an immune stimulant, and that is why I don't understand why my horse has recurrent hives. Once I raised the dose above 1mg he starting having recurrent hives. I would think it would be the other way around. He is on 2mg now and broke out in hives in January that took 2 1/2 months to get rid of and then again a breakout in July that took 3 months to get rid of. In 07 he had his first and only hive breakout in March that took 3 weeks to get rid of and he was on 1 1/2 mg of Pergolide then. I could go on and on with all the other variables, but he never had a bump on his body until I raised the Pergolide above 1 mg. My Vet thought I should ask these questions to see what kind of response I got, because we have exhausted all the alternatives. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 21732
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Friday, Nov 14, 2008 - 7:30 am: | |
It is possible your horse is becoming allergic to the Pergolide Patricia. But there is another possibility. Recurring hives is a pretty common event often reported on these pages. If your horse has some other allergy but without medication the immune suppression prevents reaction. You administer the medication and help the immune system return to a more normal function and now the allergy blossoms up.
If founder is not a problem in your horse you could try slowly lowering the dosage to see if the hives go away but you are still left with the question of the two possibilities.
DrO |
Patricia Snyder
Member
Username: snyderpm
Post Number: 8
Registered: 2-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, Nov 16, 2008 - 12:30 pm: | |
I have been contemplating your remark about my horse becoming allergic to Pergolide. I must admit, I don't quite understand part of your post. The part where you wrote "If your horse has some other allergy but without medication the immune suppression prevents reaction. You administer the medication and help the immune system return to a more normal function and now the allergy blossoms up". I don't follow that.
I would like to add that I live in the south, and it has been hot and buggy this year, and especially buggy due to the severe drought last year. When it cools off or rains his bumps will decrease or even go completely away, and then come back in a couple of days. A couple of weeks ago he had been bump free and then the weather got warm again and sultry, he flared up with these weird looking welts on his sides. They look like bad whip marks,and are several inches long and narrow. He also had some large welts on his underbelly. He had none of the usual looking hive bumps. I did worm him with a new wormer, so the wormer could have made them worse, but the reason I don't think the wormer actually caused them is as soon as it cooled off they went completely away in 2 days. And, last week it started warming up again, and Friday it was quite warm and sultry, and sure enough these strange looking welts are on his sides again. Yesterday, and last night the temp dropped dramatically, so they should be gone today. If not I won't know what to think. He has been off Prednisolone for about a month.
He has not had any signs of laminitis in over 2 years. I have x-rayed him many times and check his blood, insulin, T4, etc., often. I test everything he eats. He gets no grass, etc. I check his feet every day, and I can't find his pulses and his feet are cool. I ride him regular, except when the hives are bad or it is too hot. He moves good, walk, trot and canter, and I have been on many, many horses. I increased the Pergolide because of his hair, but his hair didn't get real bad until I had to use the steroids for the hives. Who knows what's going on? I don't, and I can tell you that I don't seem to be able to get the help I need.
Well,anyway I would like to reduce his Pergolide and see what happens. I just received a new order of 1mg capsules and .5mg capsules. How slow do I back him off to 1mg? My vet said to drop him to 1 1/2mg right away. Is that too quick? Thank you for whatever help you can give me. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 21755
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Monday, Nov 17, 2008 - 7:11 am: | |
To put it another way: Since Cushings horses are immune suppressed and the Pergolide helps return the immune system to a more normal state, then immune mediated disease may be more obvious, including allergies.
No I think reducing the dosage by 1/4 every 3 or 4 weeks is not to fast but this is not based on any research as there is none on this question.
DrO |
