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warthog
Member
Username: warthog
Post Number: 7
Registered: 12-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2009 - 12:12 am: |   |
I have a 26 year old mare who is in good health other than severe arthritis in her knees - the right one, worse than the left. I read where dexamethasone had been used with DMSO as a carrier and an antiinflammatory to relieve inflammation of a joint and wondered if DMSO could also carry hyaluronic acid into the joint instead of having it injected? Is there any reason why this would not be a good idea to try? |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 22149
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2009 - 6:03 am: | |
Hello warthog,
The chief reason this is not a good idea is that the efficacy and safety of such a treatment has not been studied that I am aware of. You should note that HA, PSGAG, and Chondroitin are not likely to show much efficacy in severe advanced arthritis no matter how applied. I would still recommend their use orally if the budget allows for a moderately expensive therapy of limited efficacy.
DrO |
Sherry Wagar
New Member
Username: sherryw
Post Number: 5
Registered: 4-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2009 - 7:29 am: | |
I have had great success with Adequan IM on 2 of my aged horses -- 28 and 24. 28 year old had severe hock issues and was having trouble getting up when she laid down (daily) and the 24 year old had knee and hock issues as he was used as an all around (roping, cutting, etc.) horse in his younger quarter horse career. The changes in their abilities and attitudes changed quite dramatically after the recommended treatment with the adequan. I had tried various supplements, DMSO treatment, Surpass, etc., but the adequan far surpassed anything I saw with any of these other treatments. Just wanted to pass that along. |
warthog
Member
Username: warthog
Post Number: 8
Registered: 12-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, Jan 22, 2009 - 6:02 pm: | |
Thanks
How about DMSO as a carrier for BUTE? Has this been studied at all. It would seem to be a good idea to avoid the digestive system and carry the anti inflammatory right into the joint if possible??? anyone tried it? |
LL
Member
Username: frances
Post Number: 803
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Friday, Jan 23, 2009 - 7:18 am: | |
That's an interesting idea. I look forward to hearing DrO's take on it. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 22155
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Friday, Jan 23, 2009 - 8:27 am: | |
This is the idea behind "Surpass" which we have had many discussion on, run a search for more on this. Bute put into tissues in a concentrated form like you would expect with a transdermal application I beleive would be irritating to tissues, particularly the skin.
I think it is important to note that Sherry's results with Adequan IM is not typical for horses with remarkable arthritis. For more on this see Treatments and Medications for Horses » Anti-inflammatories (NSAID's, Steroids, Arthritis Rx) » Adequan, use in Arthritis.
DrO |
warthog
Member
Username: warthog
Post Number: 15
Registered: 12-2008
| | Posted on Friday, Jan 23, 2009 - 3:05 pm: | |
I've read those with great interest.
This mare's knees according to one of our vets are the "worst she's ever seen" so we're willing to experiment with different treatments as long as there is no obvious reason not to. We do plan to try the dex and DMSO although she hates DMSO because it stings - which I understand because it blisters my skin - but when we used it on a twisted fetlock on our filly the results were totally amazing. We could literally watch the swelling go down and with restricted activity she was sound in two weeks and we didn't have to try to fight her to get it wrapped or anything. It was quite amazing.
The old mare has been on glucossamine, chondroitin and oral HA for quite a while and she gets around well (we moved her to a sand paddock for reduced impact) but it's obvious her knees hurt and one more than the other. We've done bute on occasion but worry about it on an older horse as we had a friend lose his stallion to kidney failure from overuse of bute.
She has bone chips and major changes in the joints according to the vet and has a small hygroma on one knee but the one with the hygroma isn't the one she limps on. She self trims almost a mustang roll on the front and has always had a tendency to trip even when we got her at age 17 and she's now 26. So we welcome any ideas that have some logic or lit to back them up. |
elk
Member
Username: ekaufman
Post Number: 799
Registered: 3-2007
| | Posted on Friday, Jan 23, 2009 - 3:38 pm: | |
Hi warthog,
Good luck making your mare more comfortable if you can. My SOP for my aged gelding with bad knees is firocoxib, which seems to make him more comfortable than bute, hopefully with fewer GI side effects. He gets a wiener-dog dose of Previcox, which is cheaper but off-label. I found Surpass useless and expensive when I tried it on a different horse, and have not personally had luck with the injectables or the oral supplements with the severely OA horses.
My old guy still has a job (he's my foal weaner and supervisor) and more good days than bad ones, but I do watch him closely for any indication that he has crossed the line into suffering. When they can't stand comfortably, and are too worried about getting up to lie down, I worry that I have a hostage instead of a retiree. It's hard to manage gradual deterioration. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro
Post Number: 22164
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Saturday, Jan 24, 2009 - 8:33 am: | |
warthog, the parent page to the Adequan article referenced above is filled with treatment and ideas for managing your horse including information on firocoxib.
DrO |
