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Discussion on Small bald spots, itchy

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Sherri Dannenberg
New Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 1
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Thursday, Aug 19, 2010 - 9:06 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

We have World contending show horses, from Halter to WP, etc. As of last year one of the reiners had small welts, than he would be extremely itch, than hair loss. mainly around jaws, neck area, some on shoulder, no where else. This same horse started again the 1st part of June, he was pretty much filled in over the winter or cold months. Now we have others showing this same problem, some have minimal areas, some are pretty bad. We have had all kinds of skin solutions, have inject with Dex., which settles the itching briefly. Some are not so itchy, one horse can be 10 stalls away, with several in between that do not have this out of 30 horses, probably 7 have similar signs. Some vets say run allergy tests, but with so many diff. horses it cannot be the same thing. This stable is 30 years old, same practices, all horses stay inside outside of riding time, very clean, good ventilation, low on fly problems. These areas are about the size of a pencil head, sometimes they raise up like a welt,, never blister, never scab never become red, just itchy with some and hair loss,, these pictures are not real good, but these are two diff horses, one is the original horse to show these signs, I would classify him as chronic. The second is a Halter Horse,, that started showing signs early June. I have brought another horse in about 1 month ago, he starting to show signs around his jaw, lower neck, place on shoulder. It reminds me of when bug bites are bad on outside horses, and the skin peels off leaving little bald spots... not crusty, bloody ossy or red.
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Sherri Dannenberg
New Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 4
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Friday, Aug 20, 2010 - 1:27 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

photo of horse that has had this for two diff. seasons,, he is by far the worst..
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Sara Wolff
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Username: mrose

Post Number: 6002
Registered: 1-2000
Posted on Friday, Aug 20, 2010 - 1:51 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Only one picture came up.

Weird though. My sister-in-law's horse got something like this a couple of years ago. Her's started on the neck, then a few spots where the rear edge of her saddle blanket hit, then over her entire body. Kathy tried everything. Vet was out and did cultures etc. but never could figure out what it was. A couple of other horses in the barn got it also. In her case,though, the bumps were hard little knots scattered seemingly at random. If you scraped them, a little scab would come off with some hair. The mare was on Dex and antihistamines, bathed in special shampoos, cold hosed etc. Eventually it went away and hasn't come back. I think the suspicion was that whatever it was came in with a couple of horses new to the barn. Why just a few of the horses got it I have no idea. I've wondered if the grooms weren't careful about using shared brushes. Hope you get it figured out. I'd been careful about handling/grooming the horses that have it, then going to another horse, until you get it figured out or it goes away just in case it's contagious.
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Sherri Dannenberg
New Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 5
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Friday, Aug 20, 2010 - 2:00 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

there is no scabbing, any horses that do get it, only get it on the necks primarily and their jaws,, There are no hotspots or welting prior to hair loss,-- it is itchy. Naturally most of the horses that are being shown - are the ones showing this problem. We have sooo many people in and out of the barn it is nearly impossible to not share grooming aids, we do bleach the aids, but you can only reduce cross contamination... thank you for your input
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 6
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Friday, Aug 20, 2010 - 9:40 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

This photo is the 2 yr old Halter horse,,, he started showing a few spots end of last show season, gone thru winter, first part of June started itching and showing the small bald spots, larger areas are due more to itching, now my WP horse that has been in this stable for 30 days is starting to show these small spots around the base area of his ears,, one the side of his neck at the close to point of his shoulder,,, no raised welts, no hive type areas,, no scabs, areas just become bald,, tend to be itchy.2 yr old halter horse
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Sara Wolff
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Username: mrose

Post Number: 6004
Registered: 1-2000
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 12:41 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

OK, starting with the obvious: anything new or different being used? sprays? shampoos? Any changes in feed/hay? New supplier? Is the supplier putting perservatives or sprays on the hay this year? Different bedding supplier? Different type of bedding? Does the barn have a fly spray system? Could the spray be a problem?

You've probably already done this; but if you haven't, I'd make a list of everything the horses eat, have put on them, that touches them, etc. and then see if any of it is different than it has been. I'd also see if any new horses have this and if they had it when the arrived. If so, did other horses where they came from have it? I'd also read the articles here on HA about skin deseases etc. and see if anything applies.

Boy, with halter horses, the last thing you want is some weird skin condition! You're probably going to have to be quite a detective to figure it out.
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 7
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 1:06 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

No on all of your above questions. We put up our own hay, always have. Same bulk bedding, same sprays - soaps etc.,,, no one came with this condition, no. one horse came down with this about a yr after he was here,, than much later the 2 yr old contracted it. I read every article you have to see if anything comes close, nothing really. We are at are ends,, thus reason for getting with Horse Advice, along with other vet sites... absolutely clueless, not a pretty site.
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 8
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 1:10 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

you know the only thing I can truly think of as being different,, we have a gal that likes to do homeopathic fly sprays etc... the one she came up with is vinegar/mouthwash/absorbine would something like this possibly be causing a slight burn that would irritate enough to not raise a hive but cause similar symptoms..?
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Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro

Post Number: 25109
Registered: 1-1997
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 8:31 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hello Sherri,
I agree this does not look like allergy problems but the swelling suggests inflammation. The information in your posts does not rule out many of our most probable rule outs at HorseAdvice.com » Diseases of Horses » Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings » Hair and Coat Problems / Itching / Irritated Skin » Overview of Hair Loss & Irritated Skin. Remember diseases rarely present exactly as the average case.

Be sure to follow the links to the individual articles that explain how to get a specific diagnosis. When all else fails culturing and biopsy are the way to progress toward a diagnosis.
DrO
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 9
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 10:02 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

There has not been any swelling on any of the horses. Not even hive type welts. Just lose of hair/itchy. We have been to vets before,, - now with others in the barn showing signs, like my WP horse that just came in 30 days ago,, I agree we should have cultures ran.
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Sara Wolff
Member
Username: mrose

Post Number: 6005
Registered: 1-2000
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 11:32 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

In my experience a sensitive horse can be sensitive to anything. Our one stallion has very delicate skin and we have to be VERY careful about what touches him. I would get cultures done though, in case of infection instead of just inflamation. When our afore mentioned stallion got severe hives it took us two years to figure out what his problem was; near as we can figure it was an allergy to a local rabbit brush that was really prolif those two years. He had hives though, so I realize the cases are different. It's just so many things can manifest themselves in the skin and coat it can drive you nuts before you figure it out!

btw- the ONLY type of fly spray and shampoo he can have on him is Equus shampoo and their Marigold spray. The more expensive the better,of course! Remember that, as with people, something can be used for several years with no problems then suddenly the immune system seems like it can't fight it any longer and there is a reaction. Are all the horses that have this related?
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Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: dro

Post Number: 25112
Registered: 1-1997
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 5:05 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Sherri, in your first post you say the areas "raise up like a welt". That is the swelling I am referring to.
DrO
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rtrotter
Member
Username: rtrotter

Post Number: 880
Registered: 4-2008
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 7:47 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hmmm, I would be very suspect of the homeopathic fly spray and I would stop using it right away, plus I am not so sure what Absorbine is doing in a "homeopathic" concoction. Does not sound homeopathic to me.

I have had some severe reactions to Absorbine just used straight out of the bottle, when mixed with other things,well I just don't know.

If you want to go homeopathic, I'd stick to a fly spray that's been tested and used on horses. Like Liquid-net or Equus Marigold.

I am going through something similar with both my horses. My colt has cleared up on his own, the mare has a 4" X 6" area of raised lumps, non-itchy on her right side, behind her elbow right where the girth goes. I think both horses had a reaction to Deep Woods off that contains Deet. I usually do not use such preparations choosing more natural herb containing fly sprays, but the farm I am on has those big B52 bomber flys, that no amount of garlic( although I just upped my garlic dose for the first time in years and those bomber flys seem to have stopped their onslaught in the last few days) or herbal sprays can handle.

I hope you figure it out, before there is an impact on your show season.
Rachelle
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 10
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 7:48 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

More times than not there is no swelling, when there is it would be less than a finger print if that, it is so minimal you would not notice. The first horse is the only one I have noticed the welts on. My WP gelding ( the one that has been at the stable for 30 days) had no signs what so ever. There was a few tiny bald spots on the point of his shoulder more to the neck side, than I noticed some below his ear. I did see him rubbing his head, than a couple days later the little bald spots.

What is "summer itch"?
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 11
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Saturday, Aug 21, 2010 - 8:01 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I don't use the homeade vinegar flyspray, but stable owners tend to, when the trainer works with our horses. I use pyranha (sp)fly spray.

These horses are not related, but the ones that are showing the signs are primarily Impressive bred horses. I know the Impressive lines are very thin skinned.

Dr O,, the pictures I attached are the way these horses look most of the time,, there is no scabbing, no redness, no raised areas that you can see. I will take some pictures of my geldings spots or areas. I have not been to the stable since Thursday eve. I hope I don't see much change for the worse. Thank you
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muffi delaney
Member
Username: cometrdr

Post Number: 75
Registered: 2-2010
Posted on Wednesday, Aug 25, 2010 - 6:10 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

my horses were getting 'spots' that were worse becsuse of Photosensitivity. is your WP horse in the sun a lot? just a thought.
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Sherri Dannenberg
Member
Username: zoey

Post Number: 13
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Wednesday, Aug 25, 2010 - 7:37 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Muffi, no all of our horses are in stalls, with fans, and circulation fans in breezeways. We truly feel like it is the Impressive bred horses only that are doing this in our barn, they are sensitive,, I think when we are working them on these hot sweaty days, it irritates their skins like people that get heat rash. We use Bloom and another soymeal/flaxseed/corn oil additive to help keep their skin in the best shape we can. I now have started using olive oil/lanolin on the bald areas, leave it on after I hose them off each day,, wait about 5 min. than lightly hose off those area, hoping to keep moisten and not so itchy. I have been thinking about Aveeno,, dilute and poor over those areas let set for abit.. ???
Thank you for your input
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