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  Discussion on 15 Year old grade Appendix having seizures (long)
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Posted on Friday, Feb 4, 2000 - 9:16 am:

My sons 15 year old 16 hand, grade appendix QH gelding began experiencing what I would consider severe seizures aprox. 2 weeks ago. The first one was very disturbing but I thought it was simply uncharacteristicly aggressive behavior on his part that resulted in a hard fall~ after which he seemed sort of stunned and embarassed but pretty much himself. But then this Monday at the AM feeding, he again exhibited the same behavior but proceeded to go into a convulsive seizure. On both occasions I had gone into the barn to do the morning feed. I first went down the aisle giving each of the 3 horses their 'applez 'n oatz' cookies. When I got to Tristan, he was waiting for his cookie but when he reached out to take it from my hand he suddenly and unexpectedly wheeled around to the left 270 degrees. Then this Monday he turned back around, ran the 12 feet across his stall, reared up, fell backwards, rolled onto his side and laid there with his legs outstretched,body stiff~ and trembled for aprox. 10-15 sec. I then saw his body relax and I could tell he was sort of back. He laid there for about a minute and eventually got himself up with no problem.He then stood there for a couple minutes, obviously quite shaken, with his head down. I began talking to him and saying his name quietly but he gave no response. I got some hay and put it in his stall and he immediately came over and began eating it. I saw at that point that he'd hurt his left eye. As soon as he seemed settled (and safe) I ran in the house and called my vet. By the time he arrived aprx. 1 hour later, Tristan had visibly improved. He was more alert and sociable. Had a large swelling over the eye but otherwise seemed OK. All vital signs were good. My vet did a complete blood work up and found an elevated glucose (189)which could have been arificially elevated from molassas in bran mash~ and elevated AST and CK indicating some muscle problem.
Tho we don't know the breeding on this horse, our next step is to have a DNA test done checking for HyPP. Now today, 3 days after the seizure, he(Tristan) seems depressed and anti-social. He doesn't want me to touch him or even look at him!! I think he thinks I'm the one giving him seizures! The little goat who goes in and shares his hay with him every morning is no longer welcome. He even threated to kick her this morning. This eppisode seems to have signifigantly altered his personality. He has always been a big, kind, gentle quiet horse. Affectionate and good. My son does Pony Club and 4-H with him and lower level eventing. I'm giving him 1 Bute AM and PM for any aches or bruising he may have experienced in his fall.
He has been eating 2 quarts complete pellets, 1/2 quart steamed, crimped oats, handful of sweet feed and 1/2 cup corn oil- AM and PM for probably the last six months at least. Bran mash PM feeding 2X weekly since the weather has been so cold here. Hay is a nice quality timothy/alfalfa mix. I am near Cornell Univ. and my vet did call them re. this situation and to be on the safer side, we're attempting to bring the potassium levels in his diet down as much as possible. Everything seems to be so frustratingly inconclusive. I wonder if anyone has experienced a similar incident with a horse or has any knowledge or understanding about what may be going wrong. I'm so scared for Tristan. My stomach churns now when I head out to the barn in the morning.

Posted on Friday, Feb 4, 2000 - 9:50 am:

Hello Lucia. Yes I know EXACTLY how you are feeling. If you look in the nervous system section of the disease menu you will see that I have asked Dr O for advice about my mare who has epileptic-type seizures. She has had them for 4 out of the 6 years that I have owned her although I have been lucky in that it is only since Jan 1999 that they have become violent and obviously seizures. My vet thinks that only part of her brain is affected so they are only partial seizures- having fallen down backwards with her head pulled around to her tail she then gets up and has all the shaking and jerking while she is standing up. Obviously I would rather she stayed on the floor, its safer. Last February she was referred to a local University veterinary unit and I was told that she could be put onto Phenobarbitone to control the seizures - 12 months before this my vet had refused to do so as the dose was unknown and the risks considered too high. Luckily at that time I discovered that my mare's 10 day fit cycle was being controlled by the pesticide residue on her carrots and their removal led to a seizure-free period of 6 months. I'm not sure why they came back after this, but I still suspect she was being exposed to chemicals.
Like Tristan, Cara only ever had a seizure when she started eating- oh the stress of watching her eat her breakfast every morning! Its as though she was so looking forward to her food that when she got it the release of stress was too much for her. The professor at the University could not understand this. Epileptics are supposed to be triggered by fear but I could wind Cara up as much as I liked without any problems. She is a bad traveller so the journey to hospital should have brought on a seizure as could have the sedatives she was given to help control her fear, but there was no reaction at all. Last June I gave up trying to isolate the source and put her onto the Phenobarbitone. She was supposed to stay on for about 6 months and then have them withdrawn to see if her brain had calmed down, but she had a seizure in October probably because we messed her feeding times up a bit and she had a sort of cold turkey attack. She is now on the tablets for good. I was told she would be unrideable because of the sedative effect of the drug but after just 8 weeks my vet allowed me back on board as she had adapted so well and was 100% ok on her feet. Since then we've competed at local shows and she leads a completely normal life. If you could see us galloping you would never believe that she is technically sedated!!! She is about 18 by the way. Tristan may be feeling unhappy because of muscle damage when he falls down - he may have hurt his back. Cara became very tense and unhappy, reflected in the stopping of her seasons when the seizures were coming every 10 days. As soon as they stopped the seasons started again. Has your vet ruled out liver problems? HyPP isnt a thing we ever think about here in the UK but get the test done as quickly as possible to rule it in or out. Ask your vet about barbiturates straight away. Tristan's seizures are at a dangerous level - horses weigh alot and can land badly, so you need to control them as soon as possible. There is also evidence in humans that epileptic seizures can cause brain damage which in turn leads to more seizures. Cara has some neurological defficiencies on her left side, but we don't know which came first, the fits or the damage. I hope you and Tristan are as lucky as Cara and I have been. My thoughts are with you.
Helen

Posted on Saturday, Feb 5, 2000 - 5:48 pm:

Hello Lucia and Helen,
As Helen has suggested go to Equine Diseases: Nervous System: Forums and read the related posts. Then you should check out the article: Equine Diseases: Nervous System: Juvenile Epilepsy. Though you do not have a juvenile it does discuss treatment for seizures.

The elevated glucose is probably stress related and the muscle enymes could easily be from the effect of the convulsions on the muscles.

The important thing is to rule out possibilities that are directly treatable or may give you a better prognosis than, "we don't know", and if no further information is found begin pallative treatment with anticonvulsents. Further diagnostics might include, further evaluation of the liver, a CSF tap, and head radiographs. Don't use acepromazine is this horse as it may worsen the seizures.
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Feb 17, 2000 - 1:29 pm:

Dear Helen and Dr. O~ Thank you for your replies to my concerns re. Tristan. I still haven't gotten back the results from the HyPP test but expect them soon. The week of the severe seizure that I had witnessed in his stall was a tough one for him. He seemed very depressed, grumpy and wierd. Even the kids could tell when Tristan wasn't 'himself'. I believe he had another one 3 days after the one I wrote about- but it happened outside, late in the afternoon. Totally out of sync from what I percieved to be an AM pattern. This week has been an obvious improvement. I've totally revamped my routine to hopefully defuse some of the anticipation of feedings. I imagine that can't help but help the situation but I don't delude myself into thinking it's a cure. Helen~ Your results with Cara are a genuine encouragement for me. It's all I have to latch onto... so I do!!! If the HyPP results are negative, then I'll just ask the Dr.to put him on a phenobarb type drug and see if we can manage it that way. In the meantime I've decided to start working my little, couch potato appy mare into rotation with the thought that Tristan may need some signifcant time off~ if not completely retire. She's has always wanted to be a *show pony* but she absolutely lacks experience and talent!! But she tries hard to make up for it with desire and heart~ so we'll see. My son isn't ready to give up on Tristan yet~ and I haven't either~ but I really think it's not a bad idea to come up with a back-up plan! Helen~ what type of competition do you participate in with Cara? Also, I saw in the 'past forums' that there was a woman who was dealing with a very similar situation with her mare. Have you read her posts? The past forums seem to end at 1997 or 1998. I wonder if we can access any more recent. I'd love to contact her and see how things have evolved for her and her horse (which she obviously adored). I will post back when I know more about Tristan's prognosis and treatment. Lucia

Posted on Friday, Feb 18, 2000 - 6:32 am:

Hello again Lucia, well Tristan is doing OK by the sound of things. Don't be disheartened by the evening seizure - was he waiting for his feed at the time? Cara was firmly locked in a morning routine but still had 2 evening ones when she was pestering me for food while I was busy mucking out. I took her out to graze in hand and after just one mouthfull off she went both times. Again it seemed to be the anticipation that was the trigger. In some respects they may be safer having seizures out of doors, no hard walls to crash land on, but Cara blunders about in fear while the seizure is happening so the confines of the stable actually help her.
We are looking forward to the start of the show season in April. We do some in-hand classes, equitation, dressage (ha ha ) a little low level showjumping (up to 3 feet) and hunter classes which are her favourite as she gets to GALLOP!! She isn't stunningly good at anything but we have alot of fun at shows and catch up with all our friends. I'm busy getting her fit at the moment with some gymnastic jumping (grids) and interval training. She forgets she is in her late teens and I let her dictate her speed to a certain extent as arguing with her isn't very productive!!
It sounds like you have been reading Andi's posts about her mare, Vikki. I contacted her back in 1997 and we email each other a couple of times a year- she is a good friend. The last time we 'spoke' Vikki was still doing fine having cut all sugar and oats out of her diet. She and Cara are very similar in alot of ways. You might try looking at Tristan's diet. Apparently dogs can have seizures which disappear when put on high quality food and I know there is a human diet being tried (pretty successfully too) which relies on very low sugar, low fluid intake so that the body is forced to burn proteins and fats. I'm overdue contacting Andi anyway so I'll see if she would like to talk to you. She is a very busy lady and travels alot, mind. You are quite right that she adores Vikki!
I'm glad to hear that you a feeling a bit more positive about Tristan now, even if you do choose to retire him. All I ever wanted was for Cara to be safe and the fact that I can ride her is just an added (and very welcome) bonus. Keep us updated as to your progress.
Helen
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