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Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 719
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Monday, Mar 13, 2006 - 8:13 pm: |   |
Dr. O here is a web site about a newer product containing HA.. My vet just left after giving my two horses their legend IV shots.. her prices are going up.. .. giving this shot every 6 weeks to two horses , is well.. adding up... i was reading a magizine today and this caught my eye.. http://www.hyaluronex.com/ is there any truth in the literature on this product.. ? Does the horses body absorb this product as well as IV.. ?
Thanks as always...
On the first day God created horses on the second day he painted them with spots... |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 15062
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 14, 2006 - 10:53 am: | |
They say it themselves Ann in the bioavailability section: but little has been known about its pharmacokinetics after oral administration.
That is still true. Just because you detect radioactivity from radioactively labeled HA does not mean that the HA has been absorbed in a fashion or concentration that is clinically useful. Their statement, "Evidence of the oral absorption and efficacy of HA has been documented for the prevention and treatment of diseases in humans" is true but misleading. Yes the radioactive experiment gives evidence of some sort of absorption and yes there is evidence that HA is clinically useful for some diseases, but this is not the same as showing that oral HA is clincially useful for arthritis.
DrO |
Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 720
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 14, 2006 - 5:14 pm: | |
Thanks Dr. O... kind of what i was thinking.. and the technical wording was throwing me off.. I emailed them and the response was it would be easier to talk to me in person... only i am not a technical kind of speak... ..Guess i will have to for go my Sushi dinner for the legend shots.. and the grand kids can wear second hand clothes..  Will have to manage it somehow.. <smirk>
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots... |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 15068
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Wednesday, Mar 15, 2006 - 6:38 am: | |
Ann, why are you giving your horses regular Legend shots?
DrO |
Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 722
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, Mar 15, 2006 - 10:40 am: | |
Dr. O , I give my 14 year old mare the shots every 6 weeks, she has slight OCD in her hocks and can become very stiff, also she has a old suspensor injury on a hind leg as well... After she gets the shots, I notice a HUGE improvement in her warm up and work ethic... but it only lasts maybe if I am lucky 3 weeks.. I can only afford every 6 weeks tho..  The gelding we have discussed his x rays and condition... I give him the shots to .. hopefully.. slow the DJD process ,,, i can't say one way or the other with him, but the newest x rays did show ''NO NOTICEABLE CHANGE '' so I will continue... Like I had said, I had them on oral for a few years, but did not notice the difference I notice now with the injections... I am always looking for other more convenient / cost effective products...
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots... |
Chris Stevens
Member
Username: Stevens
Post Number: 10
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, Mar 15, 2006 - 11:08 am: | |
I can only relate my own observations. I have had my 14 yr old and 31 yr old Qtr horses on an oral HA product, chondrogin EQ, for the last 3 or so years. It runs about $1/day per dose. Both improved, in my eyes, with the supplement. The 14 year old was recently put on a double dose as he was getting pretty stiff, I suspect as a result of less exercise due to bad weather and me getting yet another horse. He seems improved with the double dose.
That said, I realize that the plural of anecdote is NOT data. I have friends that do monthly Legend shots as a precaution and friends that do absolutely no additional joint maintenance. I couldn't tell who was doing what from looking at their horses.
I think it comes down to what you can afford and how well you think it's working. |
Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 723
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Wednesday, Mar 15, 2006 - 11:48 am: | |
Chris, i agree with you.. all tho, my trainer who i take lessons with weekly notices a difference in the mare as well.. is it all HYPE i have'nt a clue... BUT would love to know if there is actually an oral product that works.. my understanding is that there is research on the molecule structures going on now.. more HYPE?
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 15077
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Mar 16, 2006 - 7:05 am: | |
Ann we present the current state of research on all these products at Equine Medications and Nutriceuticals » Anti-inflammatories (NSAID's, Steroids, Arthritis Rx) » The Joint Protective Treatments.
DrO |
Chris Stevens
Member
Username: Stevens
Post Number: 11
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, Mar 16, 2006 - 10:07 am: | |
Ann, I don't know that a definitive "this oral product works" study is going to happen anytime soon. Certainly, not with the level of fidelity we get with drug studies where cultures of the baddies can be grown, exposed to the "cure" and effectivity measured with some accuracy.
If a product "works" on my horses, it may or may not "work" on another. I think the best we can do is continue to educate ourselves on options and try to find what "works" for each individual. I've tried several different products and settled on the one that seems to work the best.
When people ask me what I use, I tell them and suggest they try it with the offer to buy the remainder from them if they decide it doesn't work for them. Several have taken the challenge and I've yet to get the chance to purchase the leftover product. I've also used Conquer with very good results, but it's just too pricey for me as a daily supplement so I used it for 2 weeks and then switched back to Condrogin EQ.
I lean towards the oral supplements because I've had good results (or at least I think I have ;-) ) and it's more convenient than needles. |
Aileen
Member
Username: Sunny66
Post Number: 1096
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, Mar 16, 2006 - 10:33 am: | |
I'm with Chris on this one as far as each horse is different. However, I found for my horse that Adequan IM works the best, I also give Cosequin, but I don't think it helps significantly any more (it used to) unless I give him 6 scoops a day... and that's expensive. |
