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  Discussion on More Seizures
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New Member:
Artinres

Posted on Sunday, Mar 26, 2006 - 6:35 pm:

I had a scary experience yesterday riding my arabian gelding. I wrote about him in a previous posting, about seizures and toxins, and described how he has had the occasional seizure since October. I have felt like I could hop off anytime one might start, as he gives me warning, by stopping and then a trembling of his neck, ears and head, at the start of a seizure. Yesterday, however, we were following a friend on a wide dirt road and he started to walk to the left, off the road into some high sticker bushes. I tried to pull him to the right, but then I realized he was starting a seizure. I hopped off, in the stickers myself, and he backed up some and got further tangled in the briars. It was over quickly and then he was in a tangled mess. It took a little time to coax him out and it was painful for him. So, I learned that he does not know where he is, during a seizure, and also, instead of stopping, he is willing to keep walking to follow another horse, even if he feels a seizure coming on. So, I need to worry about his safety, as well as mine. I guess, unless he is in a totally controlled situation, it would be unwise to ride him. I do some dressage work with him in an open field, that might be okay still, but I guess our endurance riding and long days on the trail are not going to happen now. Some friends are telling me to retire him, but I feel that is premature. After we have tried this EPM meds for one month, I will consider a seizure med, like phenobarbitol, as described in the article here about seizures. I worry that I would be doping him up for these occasional seizures, just to be able to ride him. Is this very expensive, the treatment? and do they appear to be dulled by the use of it? He is just such a good friend, I want what is best for him, for his quality of life.

Thanks....
Member:
Canyon28

Posted on Sunday, Mar 26, 2006 - 7:08 pm:

laurie, I think your friends are right, retire your horse before you get hurt! Your experience reminds me of what happened to me this past summer while trail riding. My mare had just finished walking up a fairly steep but short hill. She seemed fine and we continued on a little ways. All of a sudden she began staggering to the left, just a few steps and went down like a rock, falling on my left leg. I had no time to jump from the saddle it all happened within a couple of seconds. She got back up and staggered off about 50 feet or so and fell again, this time for good. I jumped up and ran to her and she was dying. She had had a heart attack or an anyuerism(spelling?)and died within a minute of her second fall. I was devastated and in shock, too much in shock to realize I was also hurt pretty badly in the fall. I was about 200 miles from home too, but I managed to drive back to my home town to my Doctor with my left leg so swollen I could barely manage to bend it enough to shift gears in my truck. to make a long story shorter, I had a huge hematoma and blood clot just above my knee on the inside of my leg which is still open and draining just a little bit still, and this happened over 6 months ago. I had xrays which showed no damage to my knee or leg bones, but this blood clot has been awful to deal with, I probably should have had surgery to remove it. But I was also very lucky that I did not break my leg or crush my knee. My mare was buried by the kind members of the local sheriffs posse from the town where I was attending the rodeo. If It were me, Iwould stop riding your horse immediately and retire him. If you ride him in an arena its possible he could fall against the walls or fence with you and you could be seriously injured. There are so many healthy horses in the world that are waiting for owners, why risk your own health by riding an unhealthy horse? Chris, www.canyonrimranch.net
Member:
Meggles

Posted on Monday, Mar 27, 2006 - 6:28 am:

Hi Laurie

I was very sorry to read your post. I'm sure you must be feeling devastated right now.

Please feel free to email me on my private email address:
sarah.woodman@siemens.com

We can have a better chat over email rather than having to log on to the site. I will also give you Helen's private email address once you've contacted me.

Phenobarbitol seems like harsh medication but in reality, from what I understand, your horse is likely to be doped up the eyeballs for a week or so until he becomes accustomed to the medication and then he should return to normal - hopefully without seizures. You have to play about with the dose initially but you should be able to start on a low dose and build it up over a period of potentially years as required. Whether you retire him or not, it sounds as though he is in need of this medication for the safety of you both. Even if you retire him, he could injure himself badly in the field or stable if he is untreated. I'm very lucky in that my mare has never had a seizure whilst I've been handling her and so the biggest risk is the risk she poses to herself when she goes over backwards. I have made a firm decision that if she ever has a seizure whilst I am handling her, she would be retired and live out in a herd environment for the rest of her days. She stands the best chance of not being injured if she's in a field and its not worth the risk of me being injured by her.

You also have to keep in mind, that even when they are treated, they can have breakthrough seizures so the risk to you remains even if he's treated. I think Helen's mare continued to have around 3 - 4 seizures a year, even whilst treated. My mare is also having around 3 - 4 seizures a year although she's not on Phenobarbitol yet.

I wouldn't waste your money on medication for EPM but start treating him for Epilepsy straight away. When my mare started having seizures she was tested for EPM and when the results came back negative she was diagnosed with "being mareish" which seems to be a term here for 'we haven't got a clue whats wrong'. Unfortunately here in the UK, there are few vets that recognise that horses can suffer from epilepsy, let alone know what to do if they do recognise the symptoms, so I'm sure many go undiagnosed, to the risk of themselves and their owners.

You are lucky that in the US the medication is considerably cheaper than here in the UK. Helen will be able to advise you more on this.

Email me when you get chance.

Sarah
Member:
Mrose

Posted on Monday, Mar 27, 2006 - 11:34 am:

Laurie- was your horse diagnosed as epileptic? I am asking because the only horse I know of that had seizures was a boarder we had quite a few years ago. What your horse is doing sounds a lot like what he would do. He started out rearing while be ridden and progressed to walking in circles to the left when turned out, then very suddenly his entire personality changed. While turned out he suddenly charged at me, teeth bared, ears back. If I hadn't been on the other side of the arena fence there is no doubt in my mind he would have killed me! This was a horse that previously was a big, sweet TB gelding. It was very frightening and very sad. He was diagnosed with a brain tumor and had to be put down as he became a danger to others and himself.

I'm not telling you this to upset you but so you will be aware and not let yourself be in a position to get hurt.
New Member:
Artinres

Posted on Monday, Mar 27, 2006 - 10:13 pm:

Thanks to all for your concerns and I certainly will be attentive and careful. Keep you posted!
New Member:
Artinres

Posted on Monday, Mar 27, 2006 - 10:15 pm:

Another question:

Anyone ever try using a strobe light to bring on a seizure, in hopes to video a seizure? Supposed to work in humans with epilepsy.
Laurie
Member:
Corinne

Posted on Monday, Mar 27, 2006 - 11:31 pm:

Laurie,

I have worked with many many human patients in the ICU who have had debilitating effects from seizure activity and I have not heard of eliciting them with strobe lights....Although I have heard anecdotally that some children with existing epilepsy have had seizures after being exposed to strobes in video games etc.

I would think that the risk of injury to the brain while purposely causing seizures might be too great because some seizures can cause damage that is irreversible and may even cause death in some instances. Not sure if it's the same with horses but Dr. O can clarify that.

Do you want to video tape a seizure so that you may bring the evidence to the vet?

Perhaps, as someone suggested in a previous post, keeping a diary of symptoms would help without the risks of inducing one.

Good Luck. I will pray for you and your boy!

Take care,
Corinne
Member:
Canter

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 28, 2006 - 7:50 am:

Laurie, when I was in high school, I suffered a severe blow to the head and the result was petite mal seizures (which I eventually grew out of, thankfully). The doctor did say to avoid flashing lights as it could bring on an episode and I avoided the movie "flashdance" for years because of the scene where there are strobes flashing. That was more than 20 years ago (I'm dating myself) and I don't know if the science has changed and flashing lights are no longer a concern. Even if they are, I couldn't begin to guess whether or not it would induce a seizure in a horse. I think Corinnes idea of keeping a diary to link cause and effect is a good one and may provide you with better answers as to what may trigger the seizures.

Best wishes.
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