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Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Friday, May 25, 2001 - 1:06 pm: |   |
Hello Dr. O, Perhaps you can be of some help to me. My gelding had not been himself for about a month. We had three visits from the vet and found nothing conclusive until one morning I went out to feed and found him with severe colic. The vet found a large impaction and gave him fluids and stomach tubed him. During the night, he regurgatated several times. A belly tap looked as if he had either ruptured or hemmoraged his stomach. We took him to Virginia Tech where he improved steadily. (The vet had given him a sedative which allowed his esophagus to relax enough for him to vomit) Belly taps still showed a small amount of blood and high wbc, although much improved. After five days, he developed diarrhea, which improved quickly without any further fluids or treatment. We picked him up on Wednesday, and by the time we arrived, he had begun to have soft stools again, the consistency of cow manure. They released him, and my vet said that the diarrhea is common when a horse has been as sick as he has been, and that we should monitor him for about a week to see if he improves. He is getting a tube of probios every morning for 8 days. All seemed to be going great until this morning when I got a call from the vet at Va. Tech who informed me that my gelding cultured positive for salmonella, and that we should try to isolate him and take precautions with the other horses and ourselves to prevent the spread. I am waiting for my regular vet to give me a call and instructions on what to do. I have read that this too, is a common occurance. My questions are: could he possibly have contracted salmonella from some other source before the colic, i.e. rodent feces, or eating dirt? What is the prognosis, and is he contagious? Should the hospital have looked at the results of the culture before they released him? This seems to me an ongoing nightmare. I am also concerned because he has chronic laminitis. He is a valuable animal and I love him very much.
Thank You. Debbie |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM (Dro)
| | Posted on Friday, May 25, 2001 - 4:43 pm: | |
Hello Debbie,
Could he possibly have contracted salmonella from some other source before the colic, i.e. rodent feces, or eating dirt?
Yes salmonella has many sources, in fact many healthy horses harbor this organism.
What is the prognosis, and is he contagious?
The answers to these questions requires a physical exam backed up with a good general lab profile and repeated fecal cultures. If there is no concurrent disease or damage and he is improving I would say the prognosis is fair to good.
Should the hospital have looked at the results of the culture before they released him?
This depends on many factors but the pros and cons should have been discussed with you before going home.
I hope this helps.
DrO |
Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Friday, May 25, 2001 - 8:13 pm: | |
Thank you Dr. O for your quick response. He seems to be doing fairly well. I read that horses with salmonella often develop founder, and I am worried about this, as his feet are tender right now. I am surprised that I have not heard from my vet as of yet. I will call his office in the morning, and at that time I may have some more questions for you.
I have sprayed the barn with bleach water, and we are burning his manure. I don't have the space to isolate him. If he is contagious, hopefully the other horses won't contract the disease. Thanks again. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM (Dro)
| | Posted on Saturday, May 26, 2001 - 10:07 am: | |
Hello Deborah,
Bleach will not be an effective disinfectant in the barn. Do a search on "disinfectant" for several discussions on this.
DrO |
Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Saturday, Jun 2, 2001 - 6:30 pm: | |
Thank you for the tip, Dr. O. I only wish I had checked for a response from you a few days ago. Anyway, I am grateful for the information. I purchased a product from my vet called Nolvasan. He said to use 6 tablespoons per gallon of water, and that should disinfect the barn. Again, thank you!!! |
lynne ashforth (Lynnea)
| | Posted on Sunday, Jun 3, 2001 - 6:28 pm: | |
I brought a horse from the hospital and the next day he came down with salmonella. When their immune systems are compromised they are at rish for contacting this problem. My vet had me run 5 tests before we were sure he was free of it and then disinfect with the same germicidal detergent they use at the hospitals when they have an outbreak. It is also a vet hospitals worst nightmare. What was recommended to me is called D-128 VEDCO . I had to scrub stall walls. remove mats and replace with new ones and dig out 3 inches of barn aisle granite. I threw away his water buckets. (all this after he was declared free of salmonella). He fortunately did not develope laminitis, but he needed fluids for several days. I sympathize with what you are going through, it is hard to see a horse you love go through any kind of distress. My horse pulled through this and none of my other horses contacted it. But, it is true it is contagious. I know of no other disinfectant that is as sure as this one I recommended. My vet had worked at several vet hospitals, I hope this helps . If you want to know where she ordered it , let me know and I will try to find out for you. Good luck |
Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Monday, Jun 4, 2001 - 12:38 pm: | |
Thanks for the reply. We are certainly having a time of it here. I was told by two different vets and also read that I have to burn the manure, which is not watery at this point. More like that of a pasture fed horse. It has been raining here, and I am getting over-run with bags waiting to be burned! My horse seems to be doing very well, he is not depressed and no longer needs fluids. I may ask my vet about the product you mentioned. I called around about some of the other products Dr. O mentioned in his articles, but had no luck, although the product I do have was recommended more than once, so I hope that it will be sufficient. My vet has the reputation of being the best in this area and his very highly regarded, so I feel I must place my trust in him. You are so right, it is very hard to see an animal you love go through so much, although he keeps surprising everyone with his strong constitution. It sounds as though I still have plenty of work ahead of me, i.e. digging out the barn isle, etc. My Vet will be here on the 12th to culture him to see if he is clear of the disease. Wish us luck!
Debbie |
Suzanne Moore (Suzym)
| | Posted on Thursday, Jun 7, 2001 - 12:19 am: | |
I'm sure we ALL wish you luck! This situation is indeed a vet hospital's worst nightmare. The large animal hospital at Purdue was closed for weeks last year because of an especially virulent strain that got loose there. They had a real mess on their hands. |
Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Thursday, Jun 7, 2001 - 8:56 am: | |
I suppose that may explain why they did not run the culture on my gelding until after they released him? I have been wondering about that. It would have been much more simple to keep him there till he was free of the disease. They are saying he is likely a carrier, but I highly doubt that. I have owned him for almost 13 years, have shown him extensively, have kept him at 3 different boarding stables, plus my own place for the past several years and no other horses have ever gotten sick while they were around him. |
Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Friday, Jun 22, 2001 - 12:50 pm: | |
Dear Dr.O
Please try to shed some light on my situation. We have taken two manure samples so far, both positive. I am beginning to believe the vet's conclusion that my gelding is likely a carrier of salmonella. He did not get very sick, only had watery diarrhea for one day, then after a few more days, firmed up to that of a grass fed horse, which is how they are today. They say carriers of salmonella often suffer chronic laminitis. Okay - - so how did he become a carrier? Wouldn't he have gotten very sick from it at some point? I have known him since he was a two year old, and bought him just after he turned three. I cannot recall any episodes of diarrhea or sickness in him. I have read that chickens are the most likely host for salmonella in horses, and he was kept with chickens before I purchased him, and then again afterward at a boarding stable where they had chickens and peacocks running around. But, wouldn't he have gotten sick at some point?
Thanks for the help... Deborah |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM (Dro)
| | Posted on Saturday, Jun 23, 2001 - 10:37 am: | |
First Deborah, it is too early to call him a chronic carrier. I do not think shedding for several months following acute infection is uncommon.
Second, you are making a common mistake of people with sick horses: because the history is not exactly consistant with the current information you are working your self into a dither over it. It is really simple: Your horse either had a subclinical infection before he was sick and the sickness lowered his resistance to allow it to flare or it contracted this at the hospital. It is difficult to know which is the case and it really does not matter at this point. In either case what you have to do now is go forward and give your horse the best chance at recovery and prevent him from exposing others until you get five negative cultures out of him.
DrO |
Deborah Noll (Debpn)
| | Posted on Saturday, Jun 23, 2001 - 8:26 pm: | |
Thank you Dr. O. I'm glad you think he may not be a carrier. At what point would he be considered such? For some reason, both vets believe that he is. At any rate, I will not give up hope. He is doing great. Except for a little weight loss, you would never know he was sick. Also, I have been told to bag and burn the manure. Do you think taking it to the dump in plastic garbage bags would suffice? I am getting weary of all the smoke and smell (and work) but will continue doing whatever needs to be done. Thanks for the assurance.
Deborah |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM (Dro)
| | Posted on Sunday, Jun 24, 2001 - 9:45 am: | |
Hello Deborah,
It depends on your dump. If they take food waste and carcasses yes that would be fine. There is no established protocol for when he "is" or "is not" a carrier. You could make a case that half of all horses are probably carriers, the difference may be in the pathogenicity of the organism carried. Not all salmonella cultured from stools are associated with disease. I would give him 60 days then attempt to get 5 negative fecals (taken on different days). If you fail I would take it in 60 day jumps. until you get to 60 day apart tests that are negative. Unfortunately it is not proof he may not break again with shedding but pretty good evidence.
DrO |
