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JANETTE MCDOWELL
New Member
Username: Westks
Post Number: 1
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, Sep 26, 2002 - 7:39 am: |   |
I was told Dexamethazone is very dangerous to use alot of. I was advised to use an IV of liquid DMSO, and would work faster and be less harmful with side effects. My question is how much for an 800- 1000 lb filly bit by Prarie rattlesnake on nostril.AND HOW OFTEN. Still within 24 hrs of bite on 9/25/2002 between 10-12 in morning. Please answer asap! |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 6994
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Sep 26, 2002 - 9:18 am: | |
Hello Janette,
We already have information on recommendations on snake bites at, » Equine Diseases » First Aid » Forums » First Aid for Snake Bites... You can locate these using the search engine.
I know of no standard recommendation for IV DMSO in snake bite. It's use in this case would be considered experimental. The article associated with this forum gives instructions on how to give it IV including mixing, frequency, and adverse reactions.
Corticosteroids like dexamethasone are frequently recommended for snake bite but remain controversial. I personally would not use them unless the inflammation looks like it might become life threatening and then would use the shorter acting ones. The harmful effects of dexamethasone are frequently overstated. For more on this see, Equine Medications and Nutriceuticals » Anti-inflammatories, Steroids, and Arthritis Treatment » Overview of the Steroidal Anti-inflammatory Drugs.
DrO |
Dawn Friesen
Member
Username: Dartanyn
Post Number: 102
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, Sep 26, 2002 - 1:14 pm: | |
Hi Janette, just a quick additional note. My horse was also bit on the nose (one of those things I think they only do once & learn from) and swelled up so much on one side of his face that he looked like a cartoon drawing from that side. He, otherwise, tried to eat and drink normally and, thankfully, his nostrils did not close up though his breathing was definitely audible for a time. Other than bute for the first few days and a shot of antibiotic from the vet on his visit to assess; nothing else was needed and he recovered well within a couple of weeks. The vet added: that since it was on the face, it was less likely to cause any skin sloughing off so no wound care would have to follow. He was right. Maybe this helps! Dawn  |
JANETTE MCDOWELL
Member
Username: Westks
Post Number: 2
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Friday, Sep 27, 2002 - 1:27 pm: | |
We weren't as lucky as we had hoped catching it so soon after the bite. Ended up with Iv's alternating DMSO in in every other Iv bag, the other Iv we added 8cc of Gentamiacin, 20 cc of penecillan G every 24 hours, Bantamine every 4hrs ,Dexamethazone every 8hrs, Iv' s dripped at at 3 hr rate per bag. I also sprayed warm DMSO on nose and Bite area about every 4 hours, and on legs she wanted to lay down so bad, so tried to relieve pain in legs as well.
She swelled so bad her eyes almost swelled shut, tongue swelled so bad she couldn't keep in mouth, her glands under jaw and throat latch swelled 4-6", swelled all the way down neck into chest area about 3-4". she had to push and struggle to breath, but were able to avoid lancing face and nose area, well anywhere. This is a real nice, "BostonMac /Docs Perscription ",filly and did not want to cut up face or anywhere if possible. The two teeth marks from bite were 1 and 7/8 inches apart, indicating snake was older Prarie Rattler snake.
At 12:00 midnite 26 of September,2002 swelling had gone down enough for her to swallow first drink of water in 36 hours. She is now eating ground up alfalfa(2 cups), bran(1 cup), Fastrack(4oz powder type, half squirt of red cell(1oz), 2 squirts of soybean oil(4oz), about 1/2 gallon warm water, 3 grams bute mixed in mixture. Her face so sore will not allow me to put bute in mouth, rather than fight her I just mix in mash mixture, she is still too swollen to really chew hay well enough and feeling good enough now that trying to stick her with needle again is something that will cause major fight , so trying to just keep calm and comfortable and hope bute is enough to pull her out the rest of the way. still spraying warm DMSO on nose in between small feedings.
Thank you for the help and info, and thank you Dawn for the note it helped me to feel hope at least, which was dwindling for awhile. |
Dawn Friesen
Member
Username: Dartanyn
Post Number: 104
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Friday, Sep 27, 2002 - 4:50 pm: | |
So glad she's recovering now. My vet indicated that it was hard to judge the age of the snake as the swelling would spread the bite apart; he felt mine was an older snake as they tend to be more discriminating in the amount of poisen they discharge whereas the young ones have been known to "give it all they got!" and can be quite nasty. Mine sounds so mild now placed alongside yours, all the best for recovery! Dawn |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 7003
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Saturday, Sep 28, 2002 - 8:15 am: | |
Hello Janette,
I think continued antibiotics would be important in most rattle snake bites as tissue necrosis is almost a certainty. The antibiotics will help prevent gangrene. If injections have become a problem why not establish a catheter so that the horse does not have to be repeatedly stuck.
DrO |
JANETTE MCDOWELL
Member
Username: Westks
Post Number: 3
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, Sep 28, 2002 - 8:25 am: | |
Thank you , now which antibiotic , Pen G or gentamicin. My first thought is 8cc Gentamiacin, will be alot easier than 20 cc of Pen G. My gut tells me Pen G is going to be more effective. |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 7009
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Sunday, Sep 29, 2002 - 11:22 am: | |
A combination of the two would be best, they potentiate each other. If I had a choice of just one the penicillin to help retard the anerobes might be the best choice. You will have to give potassium pen (3 or 4 times daily) though if you are going in through a catheter.
For others who find themselves in this situation the next step for Janettes horse, if breathing became too difficult is a tracheostomy. Many horses with excessive swelling of the head that interferred with breathing, for whatever cause, have been saved by this procedure.
DrO |
JANETTE MCDOWELL
Member
Username: Westks
Post Number: 4
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, Sep 29, 2002 - 11:52 am: | |
Thank you the local vet told me I could use sulfa methoxazole and trimethoprim tablets 800mg/160mg, at 10 tablets 2 times a day, we started that,If this is bad choice please advise asap. I am concerned now because entire nose and upper lip area is now rock hard and still swollen enough that she cannot close mouth enough to drink water without burying face above nostrils, and cannot gather feed with upper lip, she manages to lick it up somehow. please advise what this means and is it normal part of healing process? |
Robert N. Oglesby DVM
Moderator
Username: Dro
Post Number: 7044
Registered: 1-1997
| | Posted on Thursday, Oct 3, 2002 - 7:29 am: | |
I do not think it is as good a choice, particularly with the anerobes, but opinions among bacteriologist vary on this point.
DrO |
