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Discussion on Monorchid | |
Author | Message |
Member: hev1 |
Posted on Saturday, Feb 17, 2007 - 9:21 pm: I have a 2.5 year old stallion who had two testicles showing in the scrotum until the age of about 6 months. It was noticed sometime around that age that the left testicle had "disapeared". It has not descended again since that time. I have had 2 vets palpate and they both say that they can feel "something", but it is not in the scrotum. Is it possible for a testicle to decend normally, be somehow retracted and then grow in size to become "stuck" in the inguinal ring? We have this young guy scheduled for a complete sedated exam to see what is going on - but, would this be considered an "undescended" testicle and an inherited condition (not seen in ANY of his descendants), or is it more of a mechanical entrapment that could be corrected? |
Member: lynnea |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 2:42 pm: I don't know the answer to your question, but I just brought home a welsh pony from the hospital that my daughter was given. He appeared to be a gelding , but was passed around a lot because he exhibited very stallion like behavior.....especially around mares. Being a pony, he was obviously meant for kids to ride and his life has probably been pretty difficult. My daughter took him , with the belief he was probably a cryptorchid and felt sorry for him.We took him to the veterinary hospital and ran the blood work to find out if his testosterone level indicated he had a retained testicle. Sure enough, the test proved high levels of testosterone, and they went ahead and did search out where it was. A ccording to the vet there was a large testicle in his abdomen...which they could not feel on palpation. After the removal , they drew blood again to make sure there was not any tissue exuding testosterone, and fortunately, that blood showed none. So, his stallion like behavior will probably disappear in a couple of months. I am sure Dr. O will answer your question, but I just wanted to post my recent experience with this problem in case it helps. The pony is fine and the incision is small. I am so glad he fell into our hands, he will be great for my granddaughter and he will live a much happier life ...he eight or nine years old, and we know his life has been one of isolation, because of his behavior. I am puzzled as to why no one wanted to explore the possibility of him being cryptorchid.....it was a 3,000.00 expense, so maybe that is why. His disposition is so sweet, he is worth every bit of that and more. We feel fortunate he fell into our hands, and he is lucky to gain a good home for life. |
Member: canyon28 |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 3:01 pm: WOW,seems pretty excessive to get that testicle out! I just had the same surgery on a two year old colt, one was normal, the other retained inside the second ring, inside the abdomen, although it was much smaller than the normal testicle. He was under general gas anesthesia and stayed over night. the whole thing cost me just over $600 US. The high cost of getting an abdomen retained testicle is why there are so many "geldings" out there that act like studs. which is a shame. Also there are many vets that do not do major surgery like this because they do not have the facility or skill, so that is another reason. My colt has super nice breeding/pedigree and is beautiful. It really hurt me to have to have him gelded but it was the only ethical thing to do. it cost me the 600 plus lowered his value in half because he is now a gelding and no longer has breeding potential. Now I have found out there are very few stallions around by his sire, maybe this is why? www.canyonrimranch.net |
Member: lynnea |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 4:52 pm: Christine, the original quote for surgery on a cryptorchid at this Hospital was $1500.00 plus a two day stay. But, we opted to do extensive blood work, that went to Cornell, on the hormone testing. That took a long time, so he was at the facility for a little over two weeks. The itemized bill has yet to be sent , so I am not sure of other costs. I know they had other vets involved to search for any tissue pieces or whatever to make sure everything was out. It was also hard to find the scar of a normal gelding procedure..so no one is positive he had one DrOp. They said sometimes the incision heals so well it is very hard to find it, but assume one DrOpped and the other was retained. I was told it is a genetic trait....I am in California so I know things are a little more costly here, but it was good you didn't have to pay but 600.00. This same hospital, however charges only 250.00 for a normal gelding. But, then that isn't as invasive a procedure.It is too bad about your colt, but you obviously did the right thing. |
Member: lynnea |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 4:56 pm: Boomer......any of this any help? I would like to add.....You might want to do the testosterone check before you do any sedating or exploring, just to not do anything unnecessary. |
Member: freshman |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 5:45 pm: I think that the general opinion is that cryptorchidism is a heritable condition, though there may be cases where this can't be traced to any obvious ancestor. One problem is that most folks only look back to the sire's status and others in the direct male line, and it appears that this condition can be passed on through the female line, like from dam to her male offspring, or to future produce from her daughters. Cryptorchidism is very prevalent thoroughbreds, since their selection of stallions is based on performance and they will readily breed to ridglings. The classic example is AP Indy, a cryptorchid that gets cryptorchids, and yet he commands the highest fee in the country, $300,000 per season. Interestingly, AP Indy is out of a mare named Weekend Surprise that produce 7 crypts from 8 colts.The racing industry seems to be unique in their acceptance of this defect. Many breed associations prohibit cryptorchids from breeding registerable foals, though you don't mention what breed is your stallion. In general, mare owners will aviod a cryptorchid stallion. Usually, there is a huge selection of quality stallions to choose from in any population, so there is no reason to go to a cryptorchid stallion that may threaten their investment or their breeding program. I do not think that it is possible to distinguish a genetically predisposed testicle that is undecended or one that is "trapped" mechanically in the inguinal canals. There may be cases were this happens spontaneously to some unlucky fellow that has no predisposing genetic factors. I've never heard of any procedure that "brings down" a retained testicle, but hopefully Dr. O and others can shed some light on this. |
Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 6:30 pm: Hmmm...the flaw I see in your thinking Boomer is that genetic defects are expressed through defects in biological, chemical, or possibly in this case physical properties. In this case we can hypothesize a failure of the cremaster muscle and ligament to elongate resulting in the testicle to be drawn up into the inguinal canal as the rest of the horse grows. The question that cannot be answered with certainty is whether or not this in a genetic problem.DrO |
Member: canyon28 |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 - 7:03 pm: Ok, here is another thing to ponder. My horses are all AQHA, so the can be registered regardless, but not shown at halter if crypt. I do not raise halter horses, only reining and reined cowhorses, cutters. Anyhow the mare that had this crypt has had five or six other colts, all by different stallions,in fact all but one of the six foals she has had while I have owned her have been colts, and this is the first one that has ever been a crypt. Every one of her foals since I have owned her have been by a different stallion. so, I think if this were something passed by a mare, she would have had another colt by now with the same problem.I am with Dr O, I think possibly that the muscle and the ligament did not elongate or grow properly, causing the testicle to be retracted into the canal. here is also another thing to think about. I had one other crypt colt the same year, totally different breeding. He was called a high flanker by my vet and he was able to get it out here at the ranch. that tube /muscle/ligament, whatever on that retained testicle was defintely shorter than the normal one. One other odd thing, this colt had only one wolf tooth, and it was on the same side as the normal testicle. The other side of his mouth, on the same side as where the retained testicle was,had no tooth at all.Not sure if that is just a coincedence. I forgot to ask my vet if the colt that required surgery had the same thing or not. chris |
Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Monday, Feb 19, 2007 - 6:47 am: Your reasoning is faulty Christine, if the defect recessive it would require being bred to another stallion with the gene. So the idea that it only happened with one stallion does not support the idea that it is not genetic. In the case of variable expression the situation becomes more complicated.You would have been more correct to say "she had only been bred to one other stallion six times and it happened only once", would be less likely to be genetic but still not something you could rule out with certainty. DrO |