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Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 22
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 11:30 am: |   |
Hello, everyone. I'm going to be asking some pretty tough questions here. In fact, they're so tough I'm not sure just what my answers are...and that's why I'm coming to you guys. I'm so "close" to this situation that I'm finding I'm not horribly objective and I'm hoping that you guys can help me with that. I welcome ALL opinions. I know this subject can get awfully touchy and I hope that all who respond respect each and every poster's right to their own opinions. With that said, let me tell you a story...
In October of '04 I leased out a then-2 year old mare to a couple that I had checked out and felt quite confident would take excellent care of my horse. I was unable to go to see the mare throughout most of the winter but kept in touch via email. When I inquired, I was assured the mare was doing well. At that point, I had no reason to question those assurances. In the past few weeks I'd gotten 5 or 6 emails from this couple always starting out with some other topic, but eventually adding in a small blurb that the mare was "just fine" or "doing well" or some version of that. Since I hadn't inquired, and the frequency of the emails suddenly increased, I became suspicious and made a surprise trip to see the mare. What I found made me SO angry that all I could do was cry. My mare, who went to this place in show condition, was missing large patches of hair from a rampant fungal infection, was confined in a stall that had virtually NO natural light and was so underweight I couldn't believe it was my mare. The "hay" she was pawing through had patches of mold all over the "best" parts and the remainder was blackened and downright nasty!
The lease was immediately terminated and I brought my mare home. The folks that had her feel I've been very unfair in doing so, as they don't see anything wrong with the way she looks. My mare is the only horse on the farm that looks like this. All of the others are in decent shape - not fat, but decent. I was told, "Well we've already put 100 lbs. back on her. When the spring grasses come back in, she'll just bloom right up." After getting her home, I checked my records of her weight when she left here in October. I compared it to her current weight and found that she is almost 200 lbs. thinner after being in their "care". If they truly HAVE put 100 lbs. back on her, that means they starved a total of 300 lbs. off my mare. The whole thing just sickens me and I can't help feeling some measure of guilt for what she went through. The best is yet to come, though.
The day after I brought the mare back home, the woman that leased her called me on the phone to be...well...nasty. She continued to argue about the mare's lease and condition and when I flatly refused to change my mind she stated, "Well, she was going to fatten right up as the pregnancy progressed!" To say I was flabbergasted is an understatement. As it turns out, they decided to breed my mare (as a 3 year old, no less) to their stallion without consulting me first. I strive very hard to breed quality animals and always choose stallions that will breed my mares "up". That way, the resulting foal is even better than it's parents. Their stallion is by far an inferior stud. I was told she was bred 4 times this month before going "out" and that she should be back "in" any day. So far, I've not seen any signs of heat and have already discussed with my vet doing a sonogram to confirm (or not) a pregnancy. Here's where this long story starts to take a sticky twist.
Knowing that my mare is rather young to be bred (3 yrs.), is 200 lbs. underweight currently, and has been bred to an inferior stud...should I be planning to abort the pregnancy before it goes past 20 days...or should I just allow the pregnancy to come to term? I can NOT afford to keep another baby and I worry that where it's sired by a "nobody" stallion what type of people are likely to purchase it. I have never had one of my horses sold/leased to a situation like this before and it's made me so paranoid. I certainly won't give the baby back to the leasing couple!! As much as I really don't want this baby, I couldn't bear it if it ended up with an owner much like the folks that had my mare. Secondly, where the mare is dragged so far down nutritionally right now, am I endangering her recovery if I let the pregnancy go forward? If I choose to abort, I've pretty much got to do it before day 20 to help reduce the risks of an ascending uterine infection in an already compromised mare. Is the risk of infection with an abortion, coupled with poor nutrition, reason enough to decline it???
Even though this mare is well-bred, I had decided long ago that she was NOT a mare that I desired to keep for further breeding. That's why I culled her from the mare band and decided to lease her out as a show mount. Since I didn't feel she had excellent enough qualities to be used as a broodmare, is THAT enough reason to abort a pregnancy...especially one to an even more inferior stud??
Granted, I'm still dealing in a bit of conjecture here, since the sono hasn't been done yet. But my vet has asked me to consider what I'd want done should the mare sono as pregnant so that he knows how to proceed.
Ok, folks. Let me know what your opinions are.
Maureen |
Little King Ranch
Member
Username: Eoeo
Post Number: 150
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 11:55 am: | |
If it was me, I would terminate the pregnancy. Otherwise, you will have to deal with a poor pregnancy and possible foaling problems. Then, you will hear from the former lessees as to how valuable that foal is. Save yourself some grief. Chances are, she might not be in foal and you won't have to deal with it. Moving her could have kept her from showing heat. EO |
Mary Lou Winn
Member
Username: Gipetto
Post Number: 5
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 12:10 pm: | |
Absolutely terminate for all the reasons you list. Unwanted pregnancy, inferior sire, mare that you would not have bred yourself, under weight and un-cared for.
She may not be pregnant, but if she is, it is pretty minor to end it at this stage.
There are too many unwanted horses in this world already. Adding another is not a kindness. |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 23
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 12:27 pm: | |
Thanks guys for posting your opinions so quickly. Initially, over the phone I had told my vet I didn't think I could terminate the pregnancy. But now I've had 24 hours to mull things over and I'm not so sure allowing it to go to term is the right thing. I, too, thought about the unwanted horse issues and I think that's the number one thing that has me scared to continue the pregnancy. All I can imagine is this poor little foal ending up cold, miserable and starving to death on some barren feedlot somewhere...like her dam was doing with the lessees.
Although I'm obviously leaning toward changing my mind and aborting the pregnancy (if there is one), I'd still like to hear the opinions of anyone else who wishes to way in on the issue.
Maureen |
Colleen Goolsby
Member
Username: Goolsby
Post Number: 295
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 12:45 pm: | |
First I like to say I cant believe these ignorant people would do such a thing and Im sorry you are having to deal with this. I hope it turns out your mare is not pregnant. I agree with the posts so far. Why would you want to put the mare through the pregnancy in her condition when you definately dont want the foal.
There are way too many unwanted horses out there that end up slaughtered. I am one of the idiots that would purchase an "inferior" foal. I've got one now comming 2 rescued from worse conditions than you described. Go visit an auction or slaughter house, that should help you make your decision.
Good luck
Colleen |
Christine Holmes Bukowski
Member
Username: Canyon28
Post Number: 115
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 1:29 pm: | |
These folks broke the lease by not taking care of your mare in the manner she was accustomed to, and also by breeding her without your knowlege and consent, which would have had to be spelled out in the lease, they broke the lease on this count. when you write a lease up, you must go over in your mind all the worst case scenarios you can think of and include rules or just in case information for these in your lease.. Your mare has been involved in TWO of these! The others would be serious injury or colic, also death, stolen, etc. In the lease I have written up , the person leasing my mare also has to have proof of insurance on the horse, which I have to see.
anyway terminate the pregnancy, which wont be a big deal if she has just been bred. At the filly's age, the foal will stunt her growth, the foal will be stunted and the if the stud is inferior you will just have a POC foal that has almost ruined your mare's future. You owe these idiots nothing and in fact I would send them the bills for the procedures and for the vet to look at your mare. Also very important, get pics of your mare right now, and date them , also have your vet write out a letter stating as to her present condition, with dates, etc, in case these so called friends try to sue or go to court over this. If these folks were your friends, I would hate to see your enemies! I applaud your guts and you are doing the right thing by ending this asap.
chris |
Christine Holmes Bukowski
Member
Username: Canyon28
Post Number: 116
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 1:39 pm: | |
Document everything that has occurred since you started getting the emails, I hope you saved them! also document everything that has happened since you went to pick her up. Some peoples idea of a fat horse or a horse in good shape is one with its ribs sticking out. I swear this is true. I have had people send me pics of mares for sale that they say are in great condition and I can plainly see the mares ribs in the picture! Which wont show up on film unless they are really skinny and in poor condition. Take closeups and also full body shots, you can never take too many pictures when documenting abuse. CYA, that is my motto, because people like this will try to turn it around on you somehow and try to blame you or the horse for her condition, or they will deny it, saying that it happened after you took her home, that is why it is extremely important to take the pics today!
chris www.canyonrimranch.net |
jos
Member
Username: Paardex
Post Number: 15
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 1:45 pm: | |
Speaking as a breeder, end a pregnancy for a mare you yourself don't want to breed with. Remember if the mother will have to earn her living as a showhorse she should be as good as she can possibly get under these circumstances having a foal won't help her.Speaking as a horselover : don't breed inferior horses its hard enough to get the good ones a nice life. Having said this I should add I would definitely end this pregnancy, and hate to do so...
Jos |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 24
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 1:47 pm: | |
Colleen,
Oh, honey, you sure aren't the only one that's been dipping into the idiot market. I think I hold a charter membership!!
I, too, bought an "inferior" horse, a stallion to boot. When I found him he'd been tied to a fence for 6 years eating only what he could reach from his tether! I couldn't let him starve to death and gambled that he wouldn't keel over dead before I could get my $250 back out of him. I gelded him almost immediately and tried to find a good buyer for him. It's now 26 years later and I've been feeding a pasture ornament all that time. In the end, it's worked out well for both of us, though. He got a good home with good care, plenty of food and affection and a warm, comfy stall on cold nights. In return, I've gotten a wonderful gelding that has been the number one BEST babysitter for all of our weanlings. He knows how to be gentle with them, but also just when to put them nicely in their places. So, I suppose, it's been one of the best $250 I've ever lost.
Chris,
I agree wholeheartedly that many of the lease specifics were broken. I have already done as you've suggested - taken pictures, documented weights, etc. The vet will be coming in the next day or so and I'm getting a statement from him, too. As for these folks paying the bills...HA! I know I'll never get the money from them and I'm really not worried about it. Not that I'm all rich and throwing money around, or anything, but the mare is my biggest concern. A long, ugly legal battle just isn't where I want to go right now. I want to put this episode as far behind me as possible. I will say, though, that I have a large network of horse contacts that have all been notified that I recommend NOT doing business with these people and if they choose to they are gambling at their own risk.
I really don't think the leasing party will bring any legal action because I really do think they know what they did was wrong, they just won't admit it. Can't give you any real specifics, but it's a strong feeling I get from some of the things that were said...and the way in which they were said.
Maureen |
Alicia Kost
Member
Username: Aannk
Post Number: 397
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 2:03 pm: | |
Maureen,
Looking at this another way, why would you want to keep the baby? If there is no reason other than you don't want to end a life, I can understand, but I would still think all the negatives outweigh that, though I am not you.
Not sure this helped  !
Alicia |
Colleen Goolsby
Member
Username: Goolsby
Post Number: 296
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 2:13 pm: | |
Maureen
To bad there arent more of our type of idiots and less of the type of idiots that leased your mare. I hold high hopes for my "inferior colt". The most precious dimond started as a lump of coal.
Colleen |
Sue G
Member
Username: Warwick
Post Number: 127
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 2:14 pm: | |
Another breeder here, Maureen. If she's pregnant, terminate it. I wouldn't think twice. |
Liliana Velasco Ariza
Member
Username: Liliana
Post Number: 217
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 3:29 pm: | |
Terminating a life is no easy choice, saving a life of suffering is, if you cannot keep the foal then I guess terminate is your only option, let's hope that mama nature solves the issue for you and being a very young mare she may re-absorbe the fetus...
Best of Luck,
P.S. Count me in the idiot club, I have 6 rescue horses plus the old man who died last week. |
D.
Member
Username: Dyduroc
Post Number: 94
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 5:44 pm: | |
Maureen, best of luck in making your decision.
Here's what I think: first of all, you've already decided you wouldn't breed this mare so the pregnancy should be terminated (don't second guess yourself).
Secondly, her value is as a show horse. Getting her weight up, treating the fungal infection and then getting her back into show condition should be your main concerns.
Lastly, I'm not as forgiving as you are. My last step would be to add up all the bills, hire a lawyer and go after them.
I hope you'll let us know how everything turns out.
D. |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 25
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 8:26 pm: | |
D.,
I don't know that I'd call myself forgiving. I truly can't excuse what these people did to my mare...nor the advantage they took of me and our agreed upon lease. If I never see nor hear of these folks again, I'll be happy. As I said, I've already contacted my network of horse contacts and put the word out about these folks. I don't see them having a very easy time of getting anyone to trust them or do business with them now. So I don't think you can call me "forgiving" for not going after them legally. I think a better description would be that I'm realistic. I'm sure that I would probably end up spending more in persuing legal action than I've lost in having to rehab a neglected mare. The important part is that I have the mare back, she's not so far gone that she can't be brought back into shape, and if I choose to, she can still be leased or sold to a RESPONSIBLE person. You can bet I'll be getting the FBI to check into the next folks! HA HA HA.
By the way, I called my vet this afternoon and told him that I want her sono'd as soon as possible so that the pregnancy can be terminated if she is indeed in foal. I hate the idea of ending a life, but as someone posted earlier there's enough unwanted horses in this world that suffer needlessly and then end up at slaughter houses. Either way, it sucks. Hopefully my mare isn't in foal and I won't have to deal with having ended the pregnancy.
I'd like to thank all of you for giving me your honest, heartfelt opinions. I also want to thank you all for keeping a potentially volatile discussion so civil. I've been a member of other Internet groups where this type of discussion turns mean and hateful. The whole ordeal and then the possibility of having to end a prenancy has been very hard on me and it's been great to get other people's thoughts without it degenerating into a huge fight. Thanks, again. The vet is supposed to be out Friday, 4/1 to do the sonogram. I'll let you all know the outcome.
Maureen |
Vicki Zaneis
Member
Username: Vickiann
Post Number: 21
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 8:37 pm: | |
Good suggestions and decision. I would terminate that pregnacy ASAP if it were my mare. |
Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 670
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, Mar 30, 2005 - 9:20 am: | |
Maureen, I do not understand your dilemma.
Producing quality horses is not as simple or easy as many people believe. None of the procedures, risks and expenses involved is simple or easy.
Granted, people that have never been involved in this may have arguments on your practices. So what?
You can not explain your choices to them. They can not understand. I believe it is only after they themselves invest most (all) of their time, courage and money in a breeding program that they will start to understand what a pregnant mare means to you.
All the best to you and your mare
Christos |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 26
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 1, 2005 - 4:54 pm: | |
Hi, all. The vet was out at 10 AM today and did a thorough health exam. Since the day I brought her back home I'd noticed her chewing her hay a bit "funny", acting as though she was uncomfortable and might have some points. Her oral exam did, indeed, bear out that assumption and we floated her teeth. I'd also been noting some minor swelling in her rear fetlocks and pasterns, although she's been sound when running around the pasture. Her skin is very dry and gritty feeling and a close examination of her pasterns found a pretty dandy case of dermatitis -- most likely from the 6" deep mud lot she spent time in when she wasn't confined to her windowless stall. We'll be washing the areas twice daily and applying a combo paste of Nitrofurazoin and Azium to cure the itching and reduce swelling. The large patches of rainrot are healing well but there are still some scabs that apparently still bother her a bit as she can't stand to have anyone touch around them.
The last exam of the day was the sono and she wasn't exactly keen on the idea so he ended up giving her a low-dose, mild tranq to get her to stand still long enough to do a good sweep with the rectal probe. I can now proudly announce that I am breathing a HUGE sigh of relief -- she's NOT pregnant to their skanky stallion!!!
I want to thank you all again for helping me sort through my feelings and bringing up points that I hadn't necessarily thought of. Thankfully, I ended up not having to make the decision to take a life but having you guys to bounce things off of really helped me make what I feel would have been the right one. My plans now are to get the mare back into show condition. I've not thought beyond that for right now. Once I see her gaining back her bloom and vitality I'll begin thinking about where we're going to go from here...and whether I can find an APPROPRIATE lessee/owner for her.
Thanks, again guys.
Maureen |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 542
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 1, 2005 - 8:01 pm: | |
I'm so glad your mare isn't pg.! Poor thing. She's lucky to be back with you. Good luck on getting her back into shape and good health. Why must you lease her out? (Just curious?) Can you do a lease where she stays on your property? |
D.
Member
Username: Dyduroc
Post Number: 95
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Monday, Apr 4, 2005 - 1:39 pm: | |
Maureen, great news! I wouldn't want my mare bred to a 'skanky stallion' either. (That's a technical term, isn't it?)
Wishing your girl a full and speedy return to show condition! She's lucky to have you as her owner.
D. |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 27
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Monday, Apr 11, 2005 - 11:21 pm: | |
Thought you all might like an update on my mare. First of all, I got the official veterinary notes/dictation in the mail a day or so ago. Although I've already told you most of it, the "official" version is more detailed, so I'll quote it here for you:
"...The mare was a 3 year old chestnut Appaloosa that had been leased out for a period of time. The mare was in a state of cachexia (general ill health and malnutrition) with her ribs, shoulder blades, pelvic bones and dorsal processes of her vertebrae protruding. Her vital signs were normal and she was bright and alert. She did have a few sharp points on her teeth and 1 cap that was removed during the floating process, but nothing significant enough to have caused the aforementioned weight loss. I would estimate that she was at least 300 lbs. underweight and that the type of muscle loss she exhibited comes from long, protracted starvation. She was also ultrasounded for pregnancy and found not to be pregnant..."
The remainder of the dictation outlined the vet's recommendations for feeding and rehabing her.
I was very pleased to see the diagnosis of "long, protracted starvation". If anything legal should ever come of this whole deal, I would think that statement alone would be very damning.
We've been feeding a very conservative diet (free choice timothy and 3 lbs. sweet, textured feed with 1/2 cup oil and vitamin supplement) to avoid pushing her into a laminitic episode. In just the 2 weeks that she's been home, she's already gained 20 lbs. I know it doesn't sound like much, but she's already looking better and with that diet is almost sure to be laminitis-free.
I do have to tell you all, though, that the saga has not ended, as of yet. Prior to bringing the mare home I'd visited the lessee's website and was just "kicking around". Nowhere was there mention of my mare on the site. Since bringing the mare home, I've been periodically checking the website and, although I made it VERY clear how upset I was about the mare's condition and that I wanted NO association whatsoever with these people, I logged onto the site last evening to find a photo of my mare with the caption "By World Champion Suitability Stallion. Owned by Maureen Taylor. Bred to ******* (the stallion's name). Due 2/18/06". As if that wasn't enough, these people had the GALL to post a picture (without my permission) that I'd taken of the mare in late September '04 when she was in show condition and still in MY care!!
I was SOOOOOOOOO angry that they would post that after all that has happened, but the fact that it APPEARED that I was the one that wanted to breed to that POC (piece of crap) stallion really irked me. And the fact that they posted my show condition photo instead of 'fessing up to what they did to her by posting a current photo just made me livid. I emailed them right away last night and demanded that my name, any reference to my farm and/or any of my horses, and the photo of my mare were to IMMEDIATELY be removed from the website. If I don't see the changes to the site or if I don't get a response from them within 3 days, I'm re-emailing them and telling them that they have an additional 4 days to remove all traces of me and my horses or I'll be sending out before and after photos to everyone on my mailing list, as well as the show circuit's mailing list. One way or another these people need to learn it's not good business to be doing the things they've done.
Maureen |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 564
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 12, 2005 - 12:17 am: | |
Personally, I wouldn't give them any more time. If all references to me weren't removed in the requested time, they'd be getting a not so friendly letter from my lawyer. And, I'd be inclined to send a copy of the vet's report to everyone I could think of also. I'd take it very personally if someone mistreated my horses! |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 28
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 12, 2005 - 12:20 am: | |
I'm going to try to upload "before" and "after" photos so y'all can see just how pitifully this mare was cared for. See if you can guess which photo is which...
 |
DEB W
Member
Username: Dwawz
Post Number: 6
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 12, 2005 - 8:17 am: | |
Maureen,
Do you have a local humane society that engages in cruelty work? I do inspections on equine for our local society and with everything you have shared if it were me I would at least bring your information to them so they can have it on file. If anything else happens on that farm the bigger the file the easier the conviction.
Deb |
D.
Member
Username: Dyduroc
Post Number: 99
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 12, 2005 - 9:40 am: | |
Maureen, after looking at the pictures, I'm very glad you brought her home. Poor thing!
Can't add anything to what Sara and Deb have already said--great advice!
Please keep us posted on your progress. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that she'll make a full recovery!
D. |
Sara Wolff
Member
Username: Mrose
Post Number: 567
Registered: 1-2000
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 12, 2005 - 10:28 am: | |
What a pretty mare. I wish you the best in bringing her back to health and condition. Poor thing! |
Cheryl Hohler
Member
Username: Chohler
Post Number: 225
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, Apr 12, 2005 - 5:58 pm: | |
OH MY GOSH!!!!!!!!
You are much nicer than me I think I would have been arrested.
Your mare is a beautiful treasure I hope she fully recovers. |
Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 696
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, Apr 13, 2005 - 9:11 am: | |
Maureen,
If this is what you cull, I'd surely like to see the horses you do breed. |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 29
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 14, 2005 - 5:05 pm: | |
Christos,
Yes, that chestnut mare was indeed a cull from the broodmare band. I'm attaching a few photos of some of my broodmares. I purposefully don't stand my own stallion because it gives me the freedom to pick and choose outstanding stallions based on bloodlines, conformation, athletic performance and overall tractability. Sometimes that means the hassles of coordinating several different AI shipments from several different stallions in order to pair each mare with the right match, but, hey...it's producing good results.
This is a 10 year old Noble Tradition x Missy Tough mare.
This is a 9 year old Surrendered x You Do It mare.
This is the only QH mare I have left. She's a 17 year old Skid King x Pat Star Adair mare.
This is an 11 year old Fine Art x Miss Master Blend mare. She's only a few days out from foaling so her croup muscles are still very slack. She was injured as a foal and her enlarged right hind fetlock prevented her having a show career but she's 100% sound on it, though. She is also the dam of the mare that we've all been discussing.
 |
Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 492
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 14, 2005 - 5:24 pm: | |
These mares are pretty massive, you say they are not 1/4 horses.. ?
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS.. |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 30
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 14, 2005 - 6:02 pm: | |
The only QH in the pack is the Skid King x Pat Star Adair mare. ALL of the others are registered Appaloosas. The top, colored mare (Noble Tradition {AQHA} x Missy Tough {ApHC}) is, as far as I know, the only colored daughter of Noble Tradition, 4 time AQHA World Champion. Depending on the stallion she's been bred to, she can produce either Western or HUS foals. The second, grey mare (Surrendered {AQHA} x You Do It {ApHC}) was CPO'd and produces HUS foals that have strides the size of Texas. The QH mare is very definitely Western Pleasure through and through, but if bred to a HUS stallion can produce a more "modern" appearing Western Pleasure horse. The bottom, chestnut mare (Fine Art {ApHC} x Miss Master Blend {ApHC}) tends to produce stocky, Western-type mares and has produced multiple Halter Futurity winners. I bred her to a 16.2 hand Hunter-type App. stallion and the resulting foal is the one that's been the subject of this thread. Unfortunately she just never attained the height and broader range of athleticism that I was aiming for. That's why the culling took place. Bred to WP stallions and Halter stallions, this mare will produce "killer" babies...but the whole HUS stallion thing just didn't work on the first try and I'm not willing to gamble on getting a less than satisfying result again. Not to say that I don't adore the filly. I wouldn't be so upset about her mistreatment if I didn't love her...but she just doesn't embody the qualities that I feel are suitable for reproduction. |
Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 493
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 14, 2005 - 6:56 pm: | |
Thanks for the reply Maureen, i too breed appy/sporthorses mainly for show jumping/ dressage/ 3 day eventing... attached is one of my mares..this pix is of her as a two year old still developing, now she is four and am breeding her to a homz appy/sporthorse stallion 
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS.. |
Maureen L. Taylor
Member
Username: Pinkapp
Post Number: 31
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, Apr 14, 2005 - 9:46 pm: | |
She's really cute!! And I'm just so jealous...you got color, too!!!!!!! Although I do have some CPO'd mares, I've had colored mares throughout the years and despite breeding to colored stallions I've almost ALWAYS ended up with solids. Some have gotten regular registrations due to characteristics, but I've had to CPO quite a few, too. I guess it's good that color is the last thing I worry about in my breeding program! I'd rather have a solid with outstanding conformation, athleticism and attitude than a colored one that's mediocre.
I'll be showing a yearling of mine in hand this year. He's out of the colored mare at the top of my photos and by a 16.1 hand black and white Hunter App. His Winter coat is really dying off now and coming out in handfuls so it gives him a reddish tint in places, but he got his Pop's jet black coat...and not a white hair ANYWHERE!!! His dam was born virtually solid but for 3 tiny white spots on her hip. By the age of 2 her mottling cropped out and she had colored out. I've CPO'd this fellow in order to show him now, but we're still holding out hope that he'll color late like his dam.
He's looking rather "hefty" in the photo because I'm feeding and fitting him to show in Halter classes this year. The plan is to then slowly strip the Halter weight from him and look at giving him a slow, steady and sturdy foundation in under saddle training. Watching him in the pasture, he seems to be able to easily lengthen and shorten his stride so we're hoping to eventually have him "switch-hitting" and doing both Western classes and Hunter classes.  |
Ann
Member
Username: Dres
Post Number: 495
Registered: 10-2000
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 15, 2005 - 1:28 am: | |
I have been very lucky with color and athletic capabilities...
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS..
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Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 698
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 15, 2005 - 4:43 am: | |
Thanks a million for the pictures and your description, Maureen.
I am not at all familiar with Western horses, their conformation and discipline standards. We have none of this in my country and rarely any all over Europe, so it is a rare chance when somebody has the time to share some thoughts about their breeding.
To explain why I like this filly so much:
Personally, I am fed up with all the athletiscism and sports performance in European breeding. Everybody seems to breed horses nobody can actually use. If you see what people breed for around here, you'll think local showjumping starts at 1,60m and that everybody goes to work in a passage.
Decent working or pleasure horses are a rarity in Greece. If you don't want a competition monster, the alternative is a local equidae that needs two years to discover trot.
Lately I've been thinking more and more that it's about time to put some QH in this picture, good old QH like this filly of yours.
Thanks again,
Christos |
Debbie Green
Member
Username: Green007
Post Number: 69
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 15, 2005 - 9:34 am: | |
I agree with Christos! I went through a very long warmblood love affair for myself and for clients, but in the past year, when the rubber hits the road I have been much more enamored with the QH types from a sheer brain perspective. They truly are the "yellow labs of the horse world" in that most people can ride them, especially the ones that are bred from quality working stock. Lets hear it for the American Quarter Horse, Paints and Appys! |
Christos Axis
Member
Username: Christos
Post Number: 701
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, Apr 15, 2005 - 11:36 am: | |
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