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Discussion on Frost damaged pasture | |
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Member: Tangoh |
Posted on Wednesday, Oct 19, 2005 - 10:51 am: We planted a new 25 acre pasture last year, a typical horse pasture mix for our soil conditions, a mixture recommended by our local agrologist that specializes in horse forages.We had over abundant rains for the last two growing seasons which caused our pasture to be particularly lush and FULL of alfalfa, which normally wouldn't flourish to this extent but conditions were perfect for ALL things to flourish. The alfalfa is only in the horse mixture to put nitrogen in the soil to help the other grasses grow better. We kept the horses off for the first year. This year we took the first cut and kept the horses off until this past week. There was considerable re-growth but we didn't want to cut it, thinking it would make great winter foraging for the horses. There is some frost damage, alfalfa is brown on the tops, but still green close to the ground and the grasses (timothy, brome...) is still very green and quite lush, although it is mid-October and has had quite a few nights of frost, but not hard killing frosts. I have heard that frost damaged alfalfa is not a problem for horses from one person, and that it is a problem from another. I should mention they grazed on a 5 acre pasture this summer that had a little alfalfa in it, so they are used to grazing some alfalfa. On the pasture in question, we are now allowing them an hour a day ( in the evening) on this frost damaged pasture and we feed them dry hay when they come in off of it into dry corrals for the nights. I have been told (by non-experts) that the nitrates in the frost damaged alfalfa will be a problem and that the sugars in the frost damaged grass will also cause a problem and that we should wait until the pasture is completely dead before we graze them. I have also been told that if the grass is still green after it snows (which it hasn't yet) will be a problem. This grass will definitely still be green after it snows. We typically see snow here in early November that stays. I have also been told that as long as we fill their bellies with dry hay prior to turn out they'll be fine on this frost damaged alfalfa pasture. I have also been told to wait 9 days (??) after a frost before turning them out. I am getting so much conflicting and differing information on this topic that I'm hoping someone on this site can shed some light. I've searched the internet, only to find conflicting information. I haven't been able to find the appropriate person to talk to about this in our area, and when I think I have the right information, I get a differing opinion from another reliable source. I should also mention our horses are not at-risk of foundering, all are in good shape, not fat and their feet are sound. We watch them carefully to make sure there's no hot hooves. We monitor their behavior after being on this pasture, as in making sure no one looks like they are sore (they all run and buck like maniacs when we turn them out in the evening for their hour of grazing so no one has sore feet). I'd sure welcome any experience, expertise or advice from you guys. |
Member: Jgordo03 |
Posted on Wednesday, Oct 19, 2005 - 2:39 pm: Sherri,I have some friends that have a simular pasture mixture that they bale for their horses each year. I called her and asked her about grazing the pasture (I've seen the horses on it at various times of the year). She told me that frost damaged alfalfa is mainly a problem in cattle because it causes bloating. Bloat isn't as big an issue with horses as it is in cattle. She doesn't graze the pasture beyond frost because of the grazing habits of horses to eat all the alfalfa and killing it during winter dormancy. If I remember my chemistry correctly, freezing causes changes in the cell walls of the plant it ferments faster and bloat-causing proteins are released at a faster rate. |
Member: Tangoh |
Posted on Wednesday, Oct 19, 2005 - 4:14 pm: Thanks Judith for your info about your friends' pasture.We aren't concerned that the horses will graze the alfalfa to the point of killing it off. We'd actually prefer the pasture to be free of alfalfa. This pasture isn't our source of hay, it was just meant to be a pasture, it just took off and grew so lush that we did have an opportunity to get a cut off it. My dad laughs because he wishes he would have had such a problem when he remembered planting a pasture in his earlier years and waiting 5 years for it to really be much of a pasture. We pretty much live in a DrOught area, except for the past 2 seasons. There's so much grass and hay around these parts this year that folks can't GIVE it away! |
Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Thursday, Oct 20, 2005 - 6:08 am: There are plants that with frost damage become toxic, usually prussic acid conversion to cyanide, but there are no reports in the literature that I can locate that implicate alfalfa or the other grasses you list as being a problem. Neither have I ever heard of anyone with such problems with these forages.Yes lightly damaged plants can accumulate nitrate and increase the indigestible sugars that promote bacteria. Badly damaged forage that form clumps of decaying material can encourage botulism growth. But I strongly suspect from your description that you are fine. There also is no problem with the grass and the snow. Anytime a sharp change in weather remarkably changes the appearance of the pasture overnight it is possible you are looking at "a change in feed situation". It would be prudent for 3 days to limit exposure to several hours a day to give the system time to adjust, and see if it is going to cause problems. This assumes you have a situation you can move them to that they are use to. DrO |
Member: Jgordo03 |
Posted on Thursday, Oct 20, 2005 - 10:37 am: Sherri,I so happy you had enough rain to get your new pasture established! We've been behind on rain all year. I've had to enlarge our pasture and keep my girls up during the day not to mention feed a lot of hay this year. We didn't sell any hay this year just so we can get by for our cattle and the horses. |
Member: Tangoh |
Posted on Thursday, Oct 20, 2005 - 11:42 am: Thanks Dr. O. for your insight. I'm not sure why, but I've gotten 'in person' advice from a lot of people, but for some reason your opinion matters more.Your suggestion of an overnight remarkable change in pasture can happen here. It would not be unlikely for the overnight temperatures to suddenly plummet to -10 or -15 celcius from the present overnight lows of around zero to -2 celcius. Your advice to leave the horses off the pasture for a few days and then monitor their grazing, if this kind of remarkable overnight change takes place, is something we can do. We are fortunate that we have a variety of feeding options. Thanks again for the sound advice and information. It seems there are more people telling us it is not a concern than those that are. They are on their 3rd day on the new pasture, but we turn them out only for a few hours each evening for now. The goal is for them to graze this pasture all winter 24/7. |